Have you ever taken a character to level 100 via T15/T16 maps?
Didn't exactly answer my question but I am working on your task right now with a block build. I'll report back when I am done.
Edit: By the way what exactly are you suggesting? You think there aren't block builds that do that all the time? That beat the guardians/shaper/uber Atziri solo?
I'm suggesting that for the purpose of maximizing gains (exp and loot per hour) a max block build that actually invests in block nodes or block based gear is going to fall far behind builds that do not.
I'm also suggesting that end game maps could not care less about max block because it only takes some rng to burst you down no matter how much sudo ehp you have and if you investment into actual hard mitigation then your clear speed and damage will suffer and defeat the purpose of maximizing exp and loot per hour.
People who use one time kills on shaper/uber/guardians as benchmarks are idiots. It does not matter you were able to guardian once deathless, it matters how often you can do it deathless over the course of 100 runs.
For the most part, shaper/uber atziri are pointless as only a small portion of the population will actually do them long enough for it to be profitable. Most people who ask "can this build do shaper" will likely do it a few times and never again.
So the question you asked doesn't even actually matter. Honestly it doesn't sound like you have ever made a good block character as you and others keep saying how much investment it takes when it really isn't that much and the mitigation is really insane. People also keep referring to this burst damage that will one shot you but that hasn't happened in my case at all. People die around me while I am perfectly fine. If you think that I can't get to lvl 100 then you are wrong.
I ran a beachhead today so please point me to these end game maps that block builds can't handle. I will prove you wrong.
Standard Forever
Last edited by iamstryker on Sep 19, 2017, 2:01:07 PM
So the question you asked doesn't even actually matter. Honestly it doesn't sound like you have ever made a good block character as you and others keep saying how much investment it takes when it really isn't that much and the mitigation is really insane. People also keep referring to this burst damage that will one shot you but that hasn't happened in my case at all. People die around me while I am perfectly fine. If you think that I can't get to lvl 100 then you are wrong.
I ran a beachhead today so please point me to these end game maps that block builds can't handle. I will prove you wrong.
Beachead is not particularly a hard map, in fact it equals a modless T15 map in terms of difficulty.
Do some of theese maps with rare mods, phoenix will be super hard with a low dmg block build.
Last edited by krenderke on Sep 19, 2017, 2:22:46 PM
I am doing Max block build this league, pushing 100 and at 99 this point.
Phoenix is actually very easy to do with Max block build, because boss's only skill that needs to avoid is easy to spot (when he kneel down), the animation time is long enough to move away.
Hydra is also a joke.
Chimera is ok, some map mode, the adds could be dangerous, but boss is totally a joke, I can afk boss, and no worry.
Minotaur, however, I do have some trouble with his one-shot mechanic, very difficult deathless for Minotaur map.
I would say, yeah, the shaper is challenge for me still. I do have more than 15 sets of shaper, will practice it later to see how max block can handle it or not. failed it once.
I agree, beachhead is a joke, it is essentially a white map. no danger for max block build at all.
Beachead is the trashiest, lowest difficulty, dullest form of "end-game" in poe. It's basically 3.0 shaped strand. I don't know why you would use that as a baseline for a build's survivalbility.
You will get instantly popped by a random boss in overgrown ruin much less guardians with any sort of damage mod. If you build tanky to actually survive these then your dps will so bad that it does not matter. Immortal tanks clearing T16's in even 6 minutes is a joke.
Why would I spend precious points or waste an entire asc in block when I can equip a rearguard or chug some rocks at way better cost performance ratio? I'm not so much discrediting block as a concept, I'm disregard actual passive node or asc investment in it.
Block is absurdly strong if it's behind a pathfinder using a legacy rumi's and kind of bad most everywhere else.
IGN: Arlianth
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Last edited by Nephalim on Sep 19, 2017, 4:26:24 PM
Neph you are on spot with overall block performance, but you forget it's dirt cheap - probably the cheapest way to progress past 85-90 on HC, with minimum or no tradind.
Yes, at the end damage will suck, you won't be able to chain farm the shaper, and you'll probably die to a random shit when you expected it the least, but it's a mechanic able to carry all those players who retire the char around 90-92 or so.
I call block super effective if your ambitions ain't so high.
Neph you are on spot with overall block performance, but you forget it's dirt cheap - probably the cheapest way to progress past 85-90 on HC, with minimum or no tradind.
Yes, at the end damage will suck, you won't be able to chain farm the shaper, and you'll probably die to a random shit when you expected it the least, but it's a mechanic able to carry all those players who retire the char around 90-92 or so.
I call block super effective if your ambitions ain't so high.
When 3.0 ticked over and with those juicy free re-spec points I invested heavy into shield with one of my mid-lvl marauders.
I took pretty much every shield node available in the tree and I admit I was laughing maniacally on the inside as I reveled in the idea that this guy was going to be badass and tanky as hell. But my revelry soon turned to horror when I got 2-shot by the first pack of generic mobs in the burning square. Literally the squishiest character I've ever created lol.
From this I learned that shields are probably best used for a stat-stick and not a reliable source of mitigation. Now I just use shields for 100 or more hp and 100 combined resists if I can get it. The block being an inconsequential stat most of the time.
Beachead is the trashiest, lowest difficulty, dullest form of "end-game" in poe. It's basically 3.0 shaped strand. I don't know why you would use that as a baseline for a build's survivalbility.
I wasn't. I was responding to what you said. I haven't done a T16 yet but I have done T15.
You will get instantly popped by a random boss in overgrown ruin much less guardians with any sort of damage mod. If you build tanky to actually survive these then your dps will so bad that it does not matter. Immortal tanks clearing T16's in even 6 minutes is a joke.
Why would I spend precious points or waste an entire asc in block when I can equip a rearguard or chug some rocks at way better cost performance ratio? I'm not so much discrediting block as a concept, I'm disregard actual passive node or asc investment in it.
Block is absurdly strong if it's behind a pathfinder using a legacy rumi's and kind of bad most everywhere else.
Anyone with a reasonable understanding of basic math can instantly see the massive flaw in random defenses like block and dodge. I'll give an example for those who aren't so good at math:
Attack 1: 25% chance to avoid damage: failed
Attack 2: 25% chance to avoid damage: failed
Attack 3: 25% chance to avoid damage: failed
YOU: DED
In that situation, you have a 1/64 chance of all three attacks getting past your defenses. Considering how often you're attacked, you have tons of 1/64 chances every day. Even the much longer odds, like failing to block five times in a row, happen all the time.
Dodge and block are reasonably solid defenses. Eventually they're going to crap out on you, though. They're both mechanics that require a ton of investment, but which essentially disappear completely at unpredictable times. They're unreliable.
The safe defenses are ones like armour, evasion, and stacking massive life/ES numbers with leech. They're flawed, but consistent. Even if what it does isn't the greatest, armour's always to work the exact same way. 33% evasion will evade 10 attacks out of 30 (and things that would change that, like monster and map mods, are knowable).
In SC, dodge and block are pretty good. I wouldn't recommend them for HC, though. All it takes is one of those common unlucky runs against the wrong boss or one failed roll against the nearly infinite one shots in the game now to land you in standard.
Did this guy just use an example with 2k damage?? LOL
