Trading was always shit, why the sudden influx of complainment threads?

"

golan4840 wrote:

Is trading really more shit now than it was months ago?

Yes, I do believe trade has gotten steadily worse over the last few months/year.
a) the sheer number of afk people/ no response people/ offline people has gone up a LOT.
b) the number of flippers and scammers has increased a lot.
c) You can clearly see the scale of market manipulation that's happening less than two weeks into
HSC with the chaos/exalt prices. This isn't random. Its a group of people deliberately crashing
the market, hoarding EX's and there will undoubtedly be a spike in EX prices later in the
league when they'll reach some absurd number like 90c : 1EX. How the hell is that healthy? Am I
playing an economy simulator instead of an ARPG suddenly?


With the influx of new players who WILL expect a more robust system for a game SO reliant on trade, poe is going to be an absolutely awful experience. The entire trading system right now with the live searches is built on sniping away cheap items from new players who haven't read the entire wiki and followed all the streamers to know how to price items.

The argument of 'they should do their research' doesn't even apply. Like come on. Are they really going to catch up on knowledge that took most of us dozens of builds and multiple leagues to learn? No, they'll have a shit, sinking feeling when they realize they sold a 3EX jewel for 1c to some scumbag. The whole argument of 'But this is wraeclast and we are exiles and this is cutthroat.' Fine, I get it. Just don't expect new players to stick around for that. The more old-school hardcore gamer might enjoy that aspect of it but you are most definitely in the minority.

Argument 2 = player interaction. The entirety of my player interaction is:
Copy paste poe.trade message, trade, ty, leave party.
I feel enriched.

The lack of a trade system has been something people have whined about for a long time. I think its just that with poe getting well deserved, global attention from players of other big-name games, it sucks that they are going to lose people to something they should have fixed years ago. It's just bad business while supporting a out-of-date ideology.

/rant

~Myth

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Mythkiller wrote:

Am I playing an economy simulator instead of an ARPG suddenly?

No, but some people are, and will, and an auction house or instant buyout or asynchronous trading or the complete removal of any player involvement won't fix that.

"

Mythkiller wrote:

Argument 2 = player interaction. The entirety of my player interaction is:
Copy paste poe.trade message, trade, ty, leave party.
I feel enriched.

Then you're fucking doing it wrong.

Not every transaction has to be a bonanza of witty repartee or meaningful conversation but the ones that go beyond the basic are worth it:

As a D2 vet that went through turn of century trading in game, to early days of D3 with Auchion house, & then its cancellation in favoor of SSF beign as loot2.0 to its current form, & then with PoE 'half Auchion house' Trading, & I can speak only for myself.

As a player experience, SSF feel much better when done correctly, as in theer is pathway to get the gears you want (not neccessary easy).

This is the reason why Blizzard eventually choose a SSF route, as loot found or crafted by yourselves, feel much better than buying one from auchion house.

having said that, saying that trading was purposely made unenjoyable or tedous so less people will want to trade, or peeople will limit their trading is either the worst design decision or the worst excuse.

For a start, if you want to control player pace to gearing, the last thing you want is to allow 3rd party to control the market.

Either design a good SSF system or make a robust trading auchion house, & control trading say maybe limit trading per day (many possibility) etc.

My 2cents

"

crystalwitch wrote:

"

Mythkiller wrote:

Argument 2 = player interaction. The entirety of my player interaction is:
Copy paste poe.trade message, trade, ty, leave party.
I feel enriched.

Then you're fucking doing it wrong.

Not every transaction has to be a bonanza of witty repartee or meaningful conversation but the ones that go beyond the basic are worth it:

Player Interaction

"

@THEM: Hi, I would like to buy your Cold Penetration listed for 1 jewellers in Perandus (stash tab "Selling")

@me: Sure thing. Come on over to my hideout.
%THEM: got lifeleech too? :P
%me: Lifeleech... lemme see...
%THEM: and hypothermia
%THEM: and inc area :D :D
%THEM: think u can buy LL from vendor as marauder :)
%me: Okay. So I've got a [Gem Linked in Chat] and an [Gem Linked in Chat]. Those're ... kinda like life leech.
%THEM: x''''''''''''''''''D
%THEM: Roflmao mate :'D
%me: I'll check the vendors, see if they've got those gems you were interested in. It'll cost a bit more though, since I've got to be the one to get 'em.
%me: Not that they've got anything against Shadows at all. Just... y'know.
%me: Okay, so I've got good news and I've got less good news.
%me: Petarus and Vanya've got an Increased Area of Effect gem available, but it'll be level 9.
%me: [Gem Linked in Chat]
%THEM: dammit
%THEM: then nvm that one :P
%me: It'll probably be the same with the life leech gem as well.
%THEM: dont waste ur time on me bro, ill just buy those u got low lvld :P
%me: I mean, you could sell it to a vendor with a regret and smack it right back down to level 1 but... that involves giving the vendor a regret orb.
%THEM: i bet u got plenty of crocodiles and kangaroos to keep off ur lawn already :'D
%me: And once you've had to sell an Orb of Regret to a vendor just to get a usable gem, you gain a whole new appreciation for the "regret" part.
%me: Anyways, 1 Cold Penetration gem for a jeweller's, right?
%THEM: y
%THEM: :)
%me: Well thanks for that.
%THEM: the ragret was to forget me ;)
%me: But...forget who? I've just been standing here talking to myself for the past few minutes.
%THEM: x'D i love ya man !
%me: I mean, you could include Haku and the others but... they never listen.
me: *sniffles*
%THEM: u made me laugh in a dark day :D
%me: Glad to hear it. You have fun, stranger.
%THEM: added u ! u2 mate.. u2 :)

LOL. That conversation was worth the hours and hours you've probably spent every league messaging 20-30 afk/nonresponsive people per item? Yea maybe i am doing it wrong by setting my expectation higher than that.

~Myth

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Mythkiller wrote:

LOL. That conversation was worth the hours and hours you've probably spent every league messaging 20-30 afk/nonresponsive people per item? Yea maybe i am doing it wrong by setting my expectation higher than that.
~Myth

Okay seriously, what are you people buying that you're getting literally dozens of afk/non-responsive people?
I just -- literally in the past couple of minutes -- picked up a 39% pair of Haemophilia gloves from the first person I whispered.

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crystalwitch wrote:

Okay seriously, what are you people buying that you're getting literally dozens of afk/non-responsive people?
I just - literally in the past couple of minutes - picked up a 39% pair of Haemophilia gloves from the first person I whispered.

If you are unaware of just how bad the afk people issue is, then you are simply the luckiest trader i've ever seen who has always gotten immediate responses.

Even trying to do something as simple as trading currency usually means i have to message 10 people before i get a response.

Now what i have noticed is that this rate of afk people fluctuates with time zones. So maybe it's just biased bad luck since I am based out of Europe and play till pretty late in the night, maybe you aren't/don't so you just happen to be online when a lot more people are online when you want to trade and that's great. But i've seen more than enough complaint/screenshots on reddit of the same to know i am not alone in experiencing this problem.

Let's not pretend there isn't a massive issue here for a bunch of us though.

~Myth

Edit:
Negative press like this is what i am talking about. It just doesn't do the game any favors to come up with excuses for why trade is like this.
https://esportsedition.com/featured/path-of-exile-trading-greatest-weakness/

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Mythkiller wrote:

Now what i have noticed is that this rate of afk people fluctuates with time zones

...I never even considered different time zones.
This makes so much sense now.

I'm an optimist so I'm thinking that with the Atlas of Worlds and the Fall of Oriath released and the Xbox release on the way, that GGGs next focus is on some sort of integrated trade function.
My mental picture is just poe.trade integrated into the notice board as a second tab, or second notice board.

Also, thanks for linking the article. It was a good read.

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Mythkiller wrote:

If you are unaware of just how bad the afk people issue is, then you are simply the luckiest trader i've ever seen who has always gotten immediate responses.

I've made around 30 trades (low budget 1alch to 1-3c) in the last couple of days and in 90% I'm getting an immediate response.

Never got scammed too.

Copy, paste, invite, tp, trade, ty; 20 seconds and done.
When i did get no respons I just picked the next one in the list to whisper at...

It's simple and quick for my part, as a new player I don't even miss an AH to be honest.

"

golan4840 wrote:

Is trading really more shit now than it was months ago?

Yes, currency is worst as far as I remember. Items are more or less same.

"

crystalwitch wrote:

I'm an optimist so I'm thinking that with the Atlas of Worlds and the Fall of Oriath released and the Xbox release on the way, that GGGs next focus is on some sort of integrated trade function.
My mental picture is just poe.trade integrated into the notice board as a second tab, or second notice board.

Also, thanks for linking the article. It was a good read.

Yea, np! I don't think that'll be the direction they take though. From an article back in feb:



So i expect that direction has already had a bunch of work put into it.

~Myth