[3.0] The Crimson Cleave Juggernaut (from Zero to white maps)

That's a very good point, I haven't not used Multistrike for so long but with all of the new support gems it makes it easier to drop Multistrike this time around.
*double post*
Last edited by Craftyman on Aug 13, 2017, 8:50:36 PM
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Tortunga wrote:
The dirty technique wheel doesn't do much for you.

The reason I took Dirty Techniques is Bleeding Duration.
Bleed only lasts 2.5 seconds on Guardians/Shaper without DiTe and 3 seconds with DiTe.
That means 3.2 and 2.66 attacks per second needed to apply 8 bleeds respectively.
The former is not realistic with slow 2-handed axe base and latter not hard at all.
Bearing above in mind, DiTe can be considered as 20% more Bleeding damage

There is Unbound Ailments support that does ailment duration as well, but I disregard it for three reasons
1) With good Attack Speed roll on Vaal Axe (best base) it is possible to reach 2.9 or even 3 attacks per second and in this case some duration provided by UA becomes redundant.
2) UA is weaker than Maim support in terms of bleed damage per second.
3) Level 21 UA needs 22 more Int from gear compared to setup without it. This contradicts with one of the goals I had in mind with this build: to avoid as much gear constrains as possible to enable less complicated Solo Self Found experience.

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Tortunga wrote:
I would drop the tireless nodes as well, and just fill out the Scion health wheel. You lose 5% health, but gain 2 points to spend somewhere ells. You would normally only take that health wheel when you filled out most other health options around the marauder/Templar area.

...

And i would properly pick up the Combat Stamina wheel, taking the life regen node. Life regen is your main health recovery system it seems, and for 3 points you get a nice 1.8% of it (with some extra
armour and 5% health).

I actually traded Tireless for Combat Stamina (+ two points) for a little more sustainability.
Scion life wheel can be finished in teh very end if needed.
Thanks for tip.

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Tortunga wrote:
I would pick up the Soul of steel armour wheel in the later stages of the game. The flat 4% physical damage reduction it gives stacks nicely with your 7 endurance charges. I wouldn't pick it up before you got 7 endurance charges though.

That's logical, but I cannot justify what to cut for it before level 94...

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Tortunga wrote:
Lastly some thing to think about; I played some dualist dual wield cleave/bleed build till act 10 on ssf hc. As The damage of a single bleed is based on the damage of both the weapons, the damage of a single bleed is roughly the same as a 2h version, as dual wield gets 120% of cleaves base damage (60% of each weapon).

As I was using swords as well I could use whirling blades, and the build felt pretty good. I would just dash from pack to pack, hitting every pack with 1 cleave and move on, while the bleed and bleed explosions would finish them off (I went gladiator ascendancy and had 100% bleed change). While the aoe wasn't amazing my leveling speed wasn't bad as i was quit mobile, and had pretty good boss damage as the bleed + ancestral totem would do most of the work while i would just dodge their attacks. To bad I died at the start of act 10, the mobs in there really hurt compared to the previous acts, so I can't provide you how it does in mapping.

Just something to consider, as dual wield does just a thingy bit lower damage per hit then a 2h, but provides better movement options (Whirling blades is so much better then leap) and attacks a lot faster (you get 15% free attack speed).

I wanted more defense for endgame Labyrinth and Juggernaut is the easiest to do that. And the only dead in act 10 is to clumsiness (Kitava's long-telegraphed X Blast) so this kinda proves that the damage/tankiness balance I wanted for this build is best with Juggernaut.

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Tortunga wrote:
A small note if you are trying it in PoB, double the bleed dps. PoB base it's bleed damage from the Mh or OH damage, and not from the combination of both.

I never thought about it. Thanks for uncovering this.
One good 2-handed axe is 50% easier to find than two good 1-handed swords with 8 bleed stacks still in reach for former (as explained above).
But outside this concern the build can be easily adapted to dual swords for smoother movement skill.


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Craftyman wrote:
I am using a 2H sword instead of an axe for taste and going to spec into some leech and replace blood magic with blasphemy/vulnerability which I think will be great in this build.

Well, you'll have to have shitload of Int on gear and that's something I absolutely do not want to mess with in Solo Self Found league...
And if you're not SSF, why not just buy Witchfire Brew?

Also, Blood Magic opens the best life nodes and without those the build is not as beefy as I would like it to be (target is 8k life with Kaom's Heart + very good gear)
Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way.
Last edited by Sarganis87 on Aug 16, 2017, 6:41:45 AM
Hey, the build looks pretty cool. I'm leveling a jugg and am going to see how it goes for me.

What are your thoughts on dropping Chance to Bleed when using Disfavour? Stacking all that extra bleed chance feels bad and both Unbound Ailments and Ruthless seem like viable 6-link options to me.
Personally I think ruthless could be really nice and it doesn't force int stacking like UA would.

I will be attempting to make a proper Vaal Axe but until then Disfavour seems like the best bet.
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godwarden wrote:
Hey, the build looks pretty cool. I'm leveling a jugg and am going to see how it goes for me.

Thanks, let us know your impressions further on.

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godwarden wrote:
What are your thoughts on dropping Chance to Bleed when using Disfavour? Stacking all that extra bleed chance feels bad and both Unbound Ailments and Ruthless seem like viable 6-link options to me.
Personally I think ruthless could be really nice and it doesn't force int stacking like UA would.

I will be attempting to make a proper Vaal Axe but until then Disfavour seems like the best bet.

Chance to Bleed support is very good (if not the best) for bleed DPS-wise even without chance itself.
PoEbuilder does not seem to take Chance into account, only DPS of one stack applied.
So if you use it - take my pastebin from opening post and play around supports there.

I'll check and update this after work, but currently 2H axes with 25% chance to cause Bleeding on Hit would allow to free one passive point in Dirty Techniques wheel and that's it.

Or Unbound Ailments (to bump duration for consistent 8 bleed stacks with slow weapon), ditch Dirty Techniques altogether, stack loads of Dex and Int on gear...
This can be done, especially if you don't mind trading alot, or in pemanent league with access to specific items, but for goals I have mind with the build, this is not recommended.

Edit:
Checked, Chance to Bleed is the third support gem after Brutality and Deadly Ailments in terms of Bleed DPS. So it is worth a link regardless of your chance to cause bleeding.
Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way.
Last edited by Sarganis87 on Aug 20, 2017, 3:22:53 PM
So.. I like this build very much, its fun to play.

I'm at lvl 77 atm and going into tier 4 and 5 maps.
Sometimes I have a very hard time with elemental Damage.

I'm trying to stack elemental resistances.

This is my gear so far:
Spoiler






Do you have any suggestions for improvement?
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riseandshine wrote:
So.. I like this build very much, its fun to play.

Good to hear that.

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riseandshine wrote:
I'm at lvl 77 atm and going into tier 4 and 5 maps.

I only did Tier 3 by now, so take my advice with grain of salt =)

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riseandshine wrote:
Sometimes I have a very hard time with elemental Damage.

I'm trying to stack elemental resistances.

This is my gear so far:
Spoiler






Do you have any suggestions for improvement?

First, get rid of Deidbell.
Defense wise it has no HP, no resists and cuts leech when in you're in trouble. Too much of a trade for just some small flat physical damage and even Deidbellow will not justify it.
An okay armor-based helm will help you to max out resists if you don't have it.

Second, Your helm, belt, boots, amulet and one ring have no life on it.
I think low life and this build's general tankiness against physical damage makes it look like you're suffering from elemental damage. But you just need more beef. Check out my gear in the second post of this thread or character Haogru in my profile.

Third, and this is general survivability advise, one of your life flasks should be either
(most people do this)
or
(I prefer this)
Instant healing is a must for regular life-based characters.
Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way.
Last edited by Sarganis87 on Aug 17, 2017, 12:22:56 PM
Firemind, I like this build!!
I´l try it.
thx for the build

Cheers Pall
I was looking for a real melee build and yours is perfect! Thanks Firemind13

I am level 49 and this build already is a real powerhouse that can take a beating and cut through mobs like they are not there.

However I think that you made a mistake with the tree in Path of Building.
If I use your tree then Overwhelming Odds only has 3 strength nodes in reach so i don't get Fortify and extra area of effect.
I used the strength node above the jewel slot so Overwhelming Odds has 4 strength nodes in reach.
Last edited by ExiledUncreative on Aug 22, 2017, 4:25:27 AM
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I was looking for a real melee build and yours is perfect! Thanks Firemind13

I am level 49 and this build already is a real powerhouse that can take a beating and cut through mobs like they are not there.

Report later on how you're doing in maps.

"
However I think that you made a mistake with the tree in Path of Building.
If I use your tree then Overwhelming Odds only has 3 strength nodes in reach so i don't get Fortify and extra area of effect.
I used the strength node above the jewel slot so Overwhelming Odds has 4 strength nodes in reach.

You don't need 40 allocated stat points for Threshold jewels, just 40 in radius.
Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way.

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