Thin line between Clever use of game Mechanis and Exploit. Monstrous Treasure shenanigans.

Yea Khaoty ggg was "ok" with it that's why they patched it. You need to learn the difference between using something like poe xyz that helps everyone with trade and that everyone knows about and can be used easily by anyone and not give an advantage to a few but to all (except the market manipulators that i mentioned as a problem) and something like an exploit that a number of people actively search for in order to gain an advantage because people who just play the game normally will never find it in the first place.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't believe they ever patched the Vaal area spawn trick. The only difference now is that vaal fragments are less desirable and there isn't much incentive to do it any longer.

So the difference is just the amount of people who know and if it's easy to do or grants an advantage to a small amount of people because the information is hidden? Should we ban all the GCP recipe users back when they were selling 20/20 gems for exalts and no one knew about them yet?

My point is GGG just needs to be clear on their messaging. I don't believe using "X amount of people know" is a good enough criteria to determine if something is bannable.

The recipe system is something you knew ggg implemented themselves for players to discover so pls don't compare it to something they had no idea about and that they didn't intend to happen, as for the vaal area spawn trick if its still not patched ggg is at fault there but players still shouldn't use the fact that because ggg didn't patch one thing that its ok to do things like that.

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Khaotyk wrote:

Should we ban all the GCP recipe users back when they were selling 20/20 gems for exalts and no one knew about them yet?

wow...just wow...

Throwing vaal roa vs phoenix exploit into the mix.

GGG has never stated this was bannable so players are either putting their accounts at risk by using it despite ggg never making an official stance or potentially being outpaced by players who are abusing it to cheese pheonix.

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Nephalim wrote:

And how many people besides the single person got a response from GGG about MT?
They let this go on for half a year and kept silent about it despite Chris' stance that it was bannable.

Is there a repository of 'rules' ggg keeps somewhere in a sub forum where they say which exploit is bannable and which is not?

I don't know how many, and I don't intend to speculate about it. Why? Because I don't know, and I never will. I just struggle VERY hard to understand if people in here are just blind, or that they actually do not see the difference between build advantages possible through balance decisions and plain out weaknesses in the code that a blind chicken could see that it shouldn't be possible.

If GGG says it's OK, by all means, use it. If the information is unknown, don't use it, as you KNOW it IS an exploit and may be bannable. I really don't see the problem here. A rule of thumb: Don't exploit the game, unless you're told it's OK.

I struggle to see an issue about that.

Don't just assume it's okay because nothing's yet been said about it.

It'd be kind of counter-productive for GGG to have said, "Hey, there's this bug with the Monstrous Treasure prophecy in maps that we haven't yet figured out how to prevent and doesn't leave any clear way for us to identify potential abusers."

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crystalwitch wrote:

Don't just assume it's okay because nothing's yet been said about it.

It'd be kind of counter-productive for GGG to have said, "Hey, there's this bug with the Monstrous Treasure prophecy in maps that we haven't yet figured out how to prevent and doesn't leave any clear way for us to identify potential abusers."

I agree. Same with bot'ing and cheating; all PR is good PR. Of course they will give the exploit as little publicity as possible until it's resolved.

Sup boys?

Did anyone provided any decent argument why pulling off map from map device is not intended mechanics?

How MT procs work now btw? Did they overhaul entire prophecie system just for that or they made it so you can't pull map out of map device anymore?

Can't answer to everything. Sorry.

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Randomzx wrote:

So there's tons of mechanics not intended and they get to choose which one gets banned for arbitrary reasons

Pretty much it. Except i think they ban mostly for abusing stuff that gives crazy advantages over other people or hurt their server / other players in one way or another.

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Nephalim wrote:

GGG is free to make up rules how they like.


However, what they need to do is clearly inform players what is okay and what is not.
Their stance on MT was that it was a bannable offense yet no where was this stated outside of a screenshot on reddit. I had asked support if players who had used the exploit in the past without knowing GGG's stance would be banned and they refused to comment so I simply stopped donating money because I thought GGG would potentially make good on their threat despite me not having used the exploit for months by the time the reddit thread was made.

The underlying issue is likely they take too long to identify issues and even longer to fix it. The best example is the league stone fiasco that started this entire mess. The bug was known for a long time but was not reproduce able on their internal server or something along those lines so it went on being abused for far longer than it should have.

MT would have been a non issue if they just fixed it a few days after it was known instead of 6-12 months later. Same for league stones.

This is what Thread is mostly about. And MT proc not being exploit of course, since you are getting advantage of loading mechanics / prophecies mechanics.^^

People keep telling it's bannable this days - where GGG states that? I never even seen this Reddit thread or whenever it was posted.

Boem
This situation with Leaguestones is really odd. According to Chris they let bug get loose for over a week, because "QA guy failed to replicate it in test realm, therefore everything was ok". And yet they ban people. But I agree on that actually, those people should have been banned, just because they get unheard of advantage over other people (this bug is just insane and comparable y cwith actual duping of currencie / loot / whatever).

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Nephalim wrote:

Throwing vaal roa vs phoenix exploit into the mix.

GGG has never stated this was bannable so players are either putting their accounts at risk by using it despite ggg never making an official stance or potentially being outpaced by players who are abusing it to cheese pheonix.

I didn't knew about that.

Vaal Rain of Arrows actually locks Phoenix in place forever?

I think I will hold off on any more support until I get a clear list from GGG about what is a bannable offence and what isn't.

Otherwise I may get permabanned one day for pressing the enter key in chat, if GGG so decides.