PSA: GGG sucks at balance
" there a few things that are completely op that need to be gutted, and most other things are at the normal level, which you choose to call trash/ but it cant be trash because the worst builds in this game now would beat the best builds in the game from 2013, so really its your choice of calling something 'trash' because it doesnt fit your own idea of what normal would be. the normal solution, as usual is to gut the very few op things in the game and leave the rest untouched the solution that majority of players like - driven by greed, self-interest, wanting to have MOAR and WIN moar and kill more and die less and having the game play itself - is to keep bringing up the normal tier up while still having op shit floating around. which brings up to the ridiculous power creep from the game in 2013 to the game we have in 2017. absolutely and utterly absurd power creep that one cant even recognize the game. more power creep than a game like D2 ever had, even before the dumbed down drops patch. | |
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GGG balance PoE as if it was some sort of international hit esport PvP game that needs extensive balancing to make sure it stays as competitive (and thus stale) as humanly possible.
In reality, it's a glorified casino-skinner box that succeeds primarily because it has zero competition in the ARPG market. I'm not saying I dislike PoE, it is my go-to have-fun game after long, long breaks. Legacy League was made to be the break-league, and to attract thirsty players to play in hopes of getting "A 1000 HP Kaoms Heart". Path of Exile is a single player, Player versus Enemy game. Why does GGG have a superiority complex (a common trait in New Zealand perhaps?), and feel the need to change the game in ways nobody wants? Some people just want to play solo (i.e every player that doesn't have two GTX Titans for high-level party play), play fun builds, and play Path of Exile. Obviously, GGG can't have that. The game has to be balanced! A solo, single player game, it has to be so massively balanced! We can't have solo players having fun! Think of the balance! The balance guys, it's so precious in Poe! But, I digress. And who are we kidding, Path of Exile is all the ARPG market has to offer. Despite what GGG does every patch, we'll always come back. It's worse than sites like 4chan, we can never escape this game. | |
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As GGG likes to state, and has stated many times, they develop PoE for THEMSELVES. NOT for the players.
That's why you have 250+ threads on Lab and not a single fuck given by GGG. At the end of the day, if the devs are not playing certain builds - why should they care about those builds to a) play and test them, b) devote resources to balance them? - If several devs were playing melee - would we still have Volatile Blood in this game? Would we have "7% more damage" joke melee buffs, and TOTEMS LOL? Would we have bosses with retarded one shots aimed at melee players? - Ever wonder why bow builds are so good and nearly EVERY patch/expansion has new bow skills and new retarded bow items? Simple, quite a few devs love playing bows. - Why does Dominating Blow still suck all these years? Simple. No dev has played Dominating Blow. - Why did claws suck for so long, and still suck? Simple. Devs were not playing claws - Why did Discharge take so long to nerf? Simple, devs were in love with Discharge and CoC rainbow builds. - Why is nearly every new skill gem either retardedly broken or full of bugs? While old skills remain fossils? Why would devs spend so much time making Wild Strike but leave Ele Hit untouched? Simple, devs love playing new skills - Why are some Ascendancy classes complete rubbish? Simple, devs are not playing those classes - so how would they know they are rubbish? List goes on. Stop expecting GGG to "balance" this game lol, they never have and never will. Last edited by Ceryneian on Mar 25, 2017, 3:24:26 AM
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Its my one complaint with the game honestly. The balance team is pants on head dumb. All they do is nerf strong items that only the top 1-5% of the population own, while completely ignoring all the crap skills, unique items, and affixes (life regen and thorns for ex.). Armour and evasion are still bad, and dont even get me started on melee both offensively and defensively.
ProbablyGettingNerfed - L100 Occultist Vinktarded - L100 Pathfinder GoogleDiversityHire - L100 Necromancer 3.13 was the pinnacle of PoE. IVYS+1 Gang 4 Life. Last edited by TheAshmaker on Mar 25, 2017, 9:02:33 AM
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" We've had our differences back in the day when there were lots of AR vs EV discussions, but we come from the same pot, which is melee. Your post is 100% true, it's like I've wrote it myself (and I have wrote a couple of similar, but shorter posts). | |
" Can i back up that the numberr of end-game viable builds is increasing, not decreasing? http://www.poebuilds.io/builds/hc?page=1 Compare the number of builds on the ladder with what we had in say, essence or prophecy. Sure, right now double dipping reigns supreme, but there are already a couple of direct damage builds that can compete as of now. Balance is working, its just a work in progress. Beeing all "but look at this poison BF scourge assassin that kills shaper in 3 seconds, and compare it to dominating blow!" leads absolutely nowhere. As far as everything melee goes that isnt BF/EQ, we'll have to wait until 3.0 adresses that before you can make a valid judgement. Melee is slightly subpar now, but it isnt like you cant do engame maps with it either. | |
" the thing with this is that its not the build diversity that is growing stronger, its the game that is becoming easier... ZiggyD is the Labyrinth of streamers, some like it, some dont, but GGG will make sure to push it down ur throat to make you like it
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" How can I compare that to previous leagues? How did you compare it? You do realize that a huge majority of the builds in the link you posted is riddled with ES keystones and ranged abilities? I mean, just a quick glance and it's very obvious. Spectral Throw, Blade Flurry, Spark/Vaal Spark, Flameblast. Currently, the best endgame thing to do is to go ES and pick a ranged skill. There are a couple of OP ranged skills and there are lots of mediocre ones that still beat every melee skill besides EQ/BF (which is ironic, since those 2 are by no means melee skills, even when they reduced AoE of EQ). I wasn't even intending on mentioning double dipping, but even that's here. Which has been going on for leagues without a fix or even acknowledgement. Balance isn't working, because there is no balance. Like the guy above said, there's only the meta shift, no balance at all. That work in progress is quite long and contradicting. If the balance is working and in progress, you would expect melee getting better over time since OB. The reality is, it's been getting weaker and weaker, consistently and efficiently. to the point where GGG started to release ranged skills with melee tags. Where is the balance there? And why has this one part of it been exactly the opposite of the balance? The gap has been bigger and bigger with the time, instead of smaller to gravitate towards balance between the two. Funny how you took Dominating Blow as an example. But instead, you can take almost all melee skills and the result would be the same. And it leads to somewhere, to an evidence of non-existing balance. We'll have to wait for 3.0 to see what happens with melee? You really think something will change and gravitate towards the balance of melee vs ranged? We've been waiting for that since at least Open Beta. We've had announcements of melee buffs and all we've received was blatant spits in the face, but at least we got a buff and less AoE :) And as Sexcalibure said, the game definitely did got way easier than a few years back. To the point where we can pretty much only get killed by "one-shots" while we're strolling through everything for hours, waiting for the "one-shot" to happen. And this is the main issue with melee builds. You can pick up fucking totems and never ever die to anything and still beat the shit out of melee in the damage section. I took a Trickster in Breach after a break and I went CI for the first time. I used Cyclone. I was immortal and bored to death 99%+ of the time spent mapping, and then the "one-shot" would happen like I was a lvl 2 character going up against Atziri trash mobs. Completely out of place events that are here to keep stuff in check for (not all) builds. EDIT: I had no armour, some crappy evasion, no stun immunity (but Cyclone fixes this, calculated, but still choppy and required me to really calculate my Cycloning, event hat didn't really make stuff harder), no endurance charges, no fortify, no blind, the shit dodge from Trickster, etc. I had absolutely no defenses at all besides CI/VP and the fucking OP unique flasks (but no Vinktars, only Sin's Rebirth and Atziri's Promise). Yet I was still strolling through 99%+ of the content, getting bored to shit after more than an hour of playing, losing my concentration and eventually getting fucked by a "one-shot". I'll never make a meta character again, it dumbs down the gameplay and I feel like I'm strolling through Normal difficulty instead of red maps+. You can just roll an ES character and pick your skill, even with not-OP-meta skills you'll still trivialize a huge majority of the content just because you went ES. Just like with ranged vs melee. And if you combine ranged with ES, it's gg. The skill doesn't really matter in the bigger picture. Just like weapons don't really matter in some builds. Like white dagger Shaper kill and the default attack Static Strike T16 clearing. It's not about the skill itself. The diversity is not what's going on here at all. You can be barefooted with no pants and still snipe the shit out of people at 300m+ with a swamp in between. It's because of the sniper and not other stuff. Try going through the nasty swamp to get in the pistol range while barefooted and with no pants, completely different outcome. I feel like your game knowledge is not up to the task here. Last edited by tinko92 on Mar 25, 2017, 9:53:11 AM
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If you think melee has constantly been getting weaker since OB, i really cant be bothered to argue with you.
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" A strawman, classic. If you really had any valid arguments you would never pulled this strawman. While I have wrote that melee has been weaker and weaker since OB, I also wrote that in comparison with ranged. Specifically, the gap between the two. And in the greater picture, melee is now weaker to play than in OB (which doesn't necessarily have to come from direct melee buffs/nerfs, but rather the changes in other areas). That's what I meant and you know it, you just have nothing valid to put on the table. You can't be bothered to argue with me? Maybe that's better until you actually learn to argue and provide valid arguments. Last edited by tinko92 on Mar 25, 2017, 10:14:38 AM
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