Gold Door

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Fruz wrote:

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Zrevnur wrote:

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Peterking72 wrote:

Instead they should spend their time thinking about improvements to the lab not trying to argue, beg for removal of things.

Removal can be improvement too.

The backtracking from golden doors is soo ridiculously small that it's insignificant, it's basically nothing.

Somehow you misquoted (in terms of relevance/response) me? Anyway whether you consider it insignificant or not: There often (or always?) is backtracking for gold doors.

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Fruz wrote:

Stop it with the bad faith for a second, would you ?

Care to explain what exactly you mean here?

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Zrevnur wrote:

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Fruz wrote:

The backtracking from golden doors is soo ridiculously small that it's insignificant, it's basically nothing.

Somehow you misquoted (in terms of relevance/response) me? Anyway whether you consider it insignificant or not: There often (or always?) is backtracking for gold doors.

Adding/Clarifying: The thing about the backtracking complaints is that they are (presumably) based on psychology and not on "hard facts". Due to that it is probably quite different (from player to player) whether a certain amount of backtracking is considered relevant or not. Some people here appear to be very sensitive to such things.

I did miquote there, took the wrong one.

This was supposed to be the quote :

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Zrevnur wrote:

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Peterking72 wrote:

You don't have to backtrack one step.

I almost always "have to" backtrack a lot more than one step. Of course you can just log out when you see a gold door like 'The_Reporter'. You dont have to backtrack then I guess.

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Zrevnur wrote:

Somehow you misquoted (in terms of relevance/response) me? Anyway whether you consider it insignificant or not: There often (or always?) is backtracking for gold doors.

The "backtracking" is so insignificant that it's actually less than the backtracking to reach most mobs ( not full clear ) in one single map :
After you get to the golden key, you keep going and open the door, and you have what ... 3 sec of backtracking to reach the door that connects to the previous area, inwhich you have what ....5~7 sec to reach the golden door ? That's 10 sec of backtracking maybe( in a place supposed to be a labyrinth, let's try not to forget that "detail" ).

It is basically nothing <=> it is not relevant <=> it's a non-argument, a fallacy, it's for people that want to QQ but don't have other better reasons / justifications.

Or one could call it .... being of bad faith, that's what I meant.

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Fruz wrote:

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Zrevnur wrote:

Somehow you misquoted (in terms of relevance/response) me? Anyway whether you consider it insignificant or not: There often (or always?) is backtracking for gold doors.

The "backtracking" is so insignificant that it's actually less than the backtracking to reach most mobs ( not full clear ) in one single map :
After you get to the golden key, you keep going and open the door, and you have what ... 3 sec of backtracking to reach the door that connects to the previous area, inwhich you have what ....5~7 sec to reach the golden door ? That's 10 sec of backtracking maybe( in a place supposed to be a labyrinth, let's try not to forget that "detail" ).

It is basically nothing <=> it is not relevant <=> it's a non-argument, a fallacy, it's for people that want to QQ but don't have other better reasons / justifications.

Or one could call it .... being of bad faith, that's what I meant.

Claiming it does not take "one step" is false or misleading. I dont see anything wrong or inappropriate or "bad faith" with my response to that.
My response was not about backtracking being "significant" or not. I dont have a problem with the backtracking and I dont particularly care if its "significant" or not.

Gold doors are pretty much Fine the way they are, think of the side area this way. The zone with the key isn't really a seperate area, it is more like a guarded part of the current area that you have to solve the puzzle (well not solve but run through) to get the key. It looks like a diff area on the map but think about it as a basement or lower level dungeon and then it makes way more sense the way its laid out. The only "change" i would do is instead of the gold key room being a normal exit area it should be behind a wall switch or other hidden style door that leads to a passageway to it. Would make way more sense thematically, same with the areas for the silver keys and trinkets.

As far as being able to stock up on keys that is Stoopid as it would break lab runs for the people who do it for time trials for the rewards. I will never earn one of the jewels this way but the people who do race it don't deserve to have it ruined.

It would also completely break the chests at the end of the run. Id gladly spend 2-3 offerings per run to be able to open every chest instead of the rng pick there is now. But while it sounds like a good idea to do once or twice it would make it a grind and not something fun. So in short Items need to disapear.

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Zrevnur wrote:

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So you mean that you had been splitting hairs from the start ?

Fair enough, I guess I'll just remember for the next time.

Just had some idea of how to make the hunt for gold keys more "interesting" - "aggravating" may be a better word - probably depends on perspective:

Make it so that there is a chance that there is no gold key in the gold chest. Make Izaro say sth like "Oh somebody took it...". And have one random monster in the area drop the key.

Edit: Or it could be "Argus you naughty!"

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poor_hobbit wrote:

Pls, add more doors, Iron door, Bismuth door, Aquamarine door. I love Doors. And Jim Morrison.

:D perfect

Personally I don't see a need to make players rush through content even faster, so I think I would rather keep gold door. And make the rewards behind solver doors a little better, at least in the last third of labyrinth if it would be too farmable or something....

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Zrevnur wrote:

Just had some idea of how to make the hunt for gold keys more "interesting" - "aggravating" may be a better word - probably depends on perspective:

Make it so that there is a chance that there is no gold key in the gold chest. Make Izaro say sth like "Oh somebody took it...". And have one random monster in the area drop the key.

Edit: Or it could be "Argus you naughty!"

I like the concept, but definitely not one random mob, and it would really punish some builds that don't Argus ( Im thinking about Cruel maybe, or Merc for example, when not overleveling ).

But I like the idea honestly.

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Zrevnur wrote:

Disconnects?

Disconnects can occur at every part of the game.

Just today I QQd a wall of text to GGG to fix their damn servers.

The European servers are a piece of shit, garbage.... You get the picture.

Other than that I don't see why those other things are relevant. I get T1 map drops even in T11 maps, so crying about getting T1 maps is not A LAB-Hater privilege, because it's a problem everyone has.


On towards improvement: I thought about another way to improve lab. As far as labyrinths go, this what we have now isn't even one. You can't loose your way or get lost in it. Can you? I mean sure if you run it the first time it's possible to wander off the right track, but after 5-10 runs everyone has the hang of it. That's why it becomes a boring chore after a while.

So what I'm trying to say here is that the labyrinth is just not labyrinthy enough. There, I created a new word. This what we have is more like a dungeon with many rooms connected to open garden like areas and dank cellars, decrepit monasteries and prison like places, also filled with traps and shit.