Largest-ever expansion 3.0.0

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OldmanBlackdragon wrote:

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Miazga wrote:

no no no
you see, you miss interpreted my words completely and you are confused about the game story and the real end game.

story part of the game:
act 1-4 from normal to merciless (you can skip all side quests)

end game of the game:
maps

As you can see from above the RPG part of the game you craving about is there and it has nothing to do with content gating.
freedom to do any map with a chance to get any map (again withing the framrare of map drop to zone level) is now gated. You no longer can drop maps you did not "unlock" on atlas even if you run zones that would normally had chance to drop them, while in the past you had this chance.
This is gated content.

Well your right that I don't understand your point. You seem to think that "endgame content" shouldn't be gated by other content, yet it's perfectly fine for it to be gated by the 3 main difficulties. You want to skip tier 1-10 maps because they are tedious, but 3x act 1-4 is fine. Yes all content is gated. Minotaur is gated by abyss just like being spit on by Gruelst and smashing little apes is gated by Merveil. Why is it ok for end game content to be gated by early game content but not by other end game content? The game would have died long ago if they didn't keep extending what end game content was, and people would just rush through content (they do anyway but it would be even worse) if they could just skip straight to the new stuff.

You are either saying something other then your ability to defeat other content and/or time constraints are blocking your path to the new content, which I don't understand what that is. Or you are saying those things shouldn't block your path. Part of the challenge is getting there take that away and the game would be boring and we all would have moved on. Everyone (with enough time to play the game) has the ability to challenge shaper, they just have to defeat other challenges to get there.

well, yeah you are right. You completely dont understand what gated content is and you do not understand my point of view nor the explanation I've given before.

I dont understand your point too, you where saying about the RNG part of the game and yet you now comparing grind though acts to end game content like both where at equal value.

From your post it seems that You thinking the leveling/Story part of the game is somewhat optional like maps, and therefore they are equally gated. When the story part (aka the leveling part) is mandatory core game and Im fine with that. We should be doing the story once and not 3 times, but that's a different argument altogether.
I dont know where you taken the skip tier 1-10 comment as I never said it, so I'm guessing you are the one not enjoying it.

You saying the game would die if the end game content would not be gated, yes you are correct, and if you havent realized by now, it was always the case. The maps drops where gated behind rules of drops, so you could not get a tier 15 map in a tier 1 map. you could only get at best +2 tier map (ie tier 3). This was a gated content too, but it was only a soft gate, as you put it.

Now days, and this is the important part, you can no longer drop any map running any map (withing the drop restriction of map tier drops), and this is the hard gating. As you are now on merci of RNG, luck or just plain old map buyouts.

So to put it in super simple terms:
Old end game:
run any map have chance for any map to drop regardless if you ever found it or run it in the past. (again I will add that the drop tier is restricted to max +2 tiers)

New end game:
run any map and have a chance for a map drop that was already discovered (ie unlocked) or is connected to the map you currently running. (drop tier is restricted to +1 until 100+ maps are unlocked on atlas)

Gated content: If you RNG sucks, and you do not get specific maps you will never progress as the not yet unlocked maps will never drop for you.


this is the simplest I can explain that to you

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Miazga wrote:

So to put it in super simple terms:
Old end game:
run any map have chance for any map to drop regardless if you ever found it or run it in the past. (again I will add that the drop tier is restricted to max +2 tiers)

New end game:
run any map and have a chance for a map drop that was already discovered (ie unlocked) or is connected to the map you currently running. (drop tier is restricted to +1 until 100+ maps are unlocked on atlas)

Gated content: If you RNG sucks, and you do not get specific maps you will never progress as the not yet unlocked maps will never drop for you.


this is the simplest I can explain that to you

First let me handle the part of your statement that is wrong.

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(drop tier is restricted to +1 until 100+ maps are unlocked on atlas)

That is completely false. you can and will get +2 tier maps well before 100 maps unlocked as long as you have any single +2 map unlocked. This is why it's very important that before you slam a stack of say 20 tier 12 maps that you have at least 1 tier 14 map unlocked or you are basically throwing away maps.

Now lets get to the rest of your argument.

First let me point out that unless your RNG is so terrible that you can't even afford 10-15 chaos to trade for any tier 15 map you like that RNG isn't gating your content trading is. With the chaos recipe and the dozens of other ways to make 10-15 chaos I think we can agree that the price of high tier maps isn't RNG restrictive.

Now if you remove trading from the game completely (which is your choice as a player to handicap your self in this way not the fault of game design) you could argue that the old system is less RNG gated then the new system, and I might agree with you. But it isn't much more gated. If you were stuck on tier 10 maps in the old system you are probably stuck close to tier 10 maps with the new system.

So to summarize my argument and make it simple for you:
RNG is not gating content unless you refuse to trade, which is completely your choice and not the fault of game design. The cost of maps is not so high to prevent players from playing that content.

If you refuse to trade then RNG could gate your content. If I understand you correctly this is your argument, to which I say trading is part of the game if you chose to ignore it, that's fine but there will be consequences such as RNG having a large impact on your enjoyment and overall game experience.

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OldmanBlackdragon wrote:

First let me point out that unless your RNG is so terrible that you can't even afford 10-15 chaos to trade for any tier 15 map you like that RNG isn't gating your content trading is.

you see this is where your argument failed about RNG not gating content, as you said it yourself that one should buy maps to progress.

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OldmanBlackdragon wrote:

If you were stuck on tier 10 maps in the old system you are probably stuck close to tier 10 maps with the new system.

this is completely not true im stuck on t13-t14 maps now not due to me not beeing able to handle higher maps, I just dont have higher maps unlocked as I do not drop the maps I need to unlock the higher tiers.
In old system I would not have this problem, so for me its a big old gated shit

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OldmanBlackdragon wrote:

RNG is not gating content unless you refuse to trade, which is completely your choice and not the fault of game design. If you refuse to trade then RNG could gate your content.

Again , this is where you agree with me, that RNG is now gating the content, and people are forced to trade. PLayers should not be forced to buy maps to progress, until atlas was released i had no problem progressing though maps to reach high tier ones, I did not have to buy any.

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Again , this is where you agree with me, that RNG is now gating the content, and people are forced to trade. PLayers should not be forced to buy maps to progress, until atlas was released i had no problem progressing though maps to reach high tier ones, I did not have to buy any.

No this is where I disagree with you.

You don't need good RNG to be able to afford maps. They are so cheap that even if you have bad RNG you should still be able to afford them. Thus RNG is not gating, trade is.

Bad RNG is not blocking your progress, your refusal to trade is. You can play the game your way but doing so has it's consequences. Either trade for maps I'm pretty sure you can afford, or play self found but limit yourself. This isn't the games fault/problem its the fault/problem of your chosen playstyle.

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qwertz wrote:

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Raycheetah wrote:

*Pet functionality that works like Portals currently do: You select the pet(s) and they appear with the character on log-in, whatever that character happens to be

Isn't that already the case? Once you summon your pets, the stay summoned even after re-logging.

Except that the pet(s) are bound to that one character. ='[.]'=

I hope they make Act 5 themed after the labrynth, full of traps and locked doors... Said no one ever


After how much they hyped the lab I'm more weary then excited for any "never before seen" mechanics and gameplay

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OldmanBlackdragon wrote:

You don't need good RNG to be able to afford maps.
<...>
Bad RNG is not blocking your progress, your refusal to trade is.

that's like dumbest shit I ever heard lol

GGG isn't a few punks in a basement anymore...

we liked them then because they tried so hard.

well... they have a lot of cash on hand, and a large
staff. I have no doubt they will accomplish this well
and on schedual.

there will be bugs, and history has repeatedly shown
us that ggg is gonna be on those bugs.

I have a lot more doubts about blizzard, and have plenty
of doubts about the other tripple A's square enix, bethesda,
ubisoft etc. I expect ggg will what they say.

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Rich85 wrote:

I hope they make Act 5 themed after the labrynth, full of traps and locked doors... Said no one ever


After how much they hyped the lab I'm more weary then excited for any "never before seen" mechanics and gameplay

You're close, I've heard from a very reliable source that their going to be taking advantage of the hallway level design from Final Fantasy XIII.

Regarding the rumor that they are going to do something that's never been done before, I think it would be cool for them to add sandbox type gameplay to POE that interacts with the real world/monsters, that would be pretty neat. Also a day/night time lighting effect would be awesome where only certain mobs appear during a certain time (basically day and night), but I guess these ideas lean more toward MMORPGs.

*edit* Another idea.. I think it would be awesome if they somehow added content/storyline/quests involving taking a boat/ship to another island/continent. Wait..didn't that happen in Diablo 2?..