GGG needs to change their view of the endgame and stop the nerf madness

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kernco wrote:

It seems like you need to stop focusing on level 100. That isn't the goal of the game. None of the maps or endgame bosses require you to reach that level to defeat them, and the highest level there's an achievement or challenge for is level 90. There is no reward for level 100.

You say that PoE is targeted at the hardcore streamers and people that play 24/7, but that's not true at all. The problem is that you're focusing on the one goal that is made for that group, reaching level 100, when there are tons of other goals you can strive for that are more realistic for a larger group players, like completing all 40 challenges or defeating the Shaper.

I have a ton of fun with the game and I know I'll never get any of my characters to level 100. I'm reaching for other goals, and these aren't goals that I had to invent myself to keep myself entertained, they're goals that GGG has specifically built into the game for me.

I'm still playing PoE so I'm finding full in it still. Your comment on not to focus on level 100 is one that many elite players say is what the non-elites should be doing. Then some of the elite players will go another step further and say The Labyrinth is optional and Ascendancy points are optional. Last league it was prophecies are optional. Oh, and a few will even go so far as to say challenge leagues are optional. WTF? I know even playing PoE at all IS OPTIONAL. I can quit and play any other game I want or none at all. This kind of view and statements like yours is just plain weird (but not unexpected). You need to validate GGG's decisions to make it look like the devs are not targeting new content almost exclusively for the 1% elite even though it is true (very few will ever see the 4 tier 16 bosses let alone defeat them to have a shot at The Shaper).

So an arpg where the level 100 goal is unattainable for most is good? Strange view that you and GGG have of making a game that alienates so many. Gating content this way is bad for business.

Why can't we buff the lesser skills for once?

And then ggg wonders why noone plays anything else other than EQ when it comes to melee.

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kernco wrote:

It seems like you need to stop focusing on level 100. That isn't the goal of the game. None of the maps or endgame bosses require you to reach that level to defeat them, and the highest level there's an achievement or challenge for is level 90. There is no reward for level 100.

You say that PoE is targeted at the hardcore streamers and people that play 24/7, but that's not true at all. The problem is that you're focusing on the one goal that is made for that group, reaching level 100, when there are tons of other goals you can strive for that are more realistic for a larger group players, like completing all 40 challenges or defeating the Shaper.

I have a ton of fun with the game and I know I'll never get any of my characters to level 100. I'm reaching for other goals, and these aren't goals that I had to invent myself to keep myself entertained, they're goals that GGG has specifically built into the game for me.

Best first response you will ever get... Can't put it better.

You don't want to be to powerfull in ARPG's it simply makes the game boring and uninteresting if you are . Sure when you first become very powerfull you will have some fun but this effect will fade quickly , then what dose the game dev do ? make harder content ? if so then they will run into the problem that only the players running what is most powerfull build / gear will be abel to complet the content , then people ( like you ) will come to the forum and rage about gated content .

It's a delicate balancing act and it's much more difficult to get right than one might think. This is why nurfs happen .


So the first question alot of people say is " well Sid thats fine but why not just buff evreything elce insted of nurfing my skill of choice , then you can incresse difficulty to compinsate "

2 main reasons for this , one it's much more difficult and costly to do all that code work for the rest of the game than just one skill , also if a mistake is made it can be fixed eayser and quieter. Number 2 reason is that games are desined around what is known as "time to kill" this is the avrage time it takes a player to kill enemeys , to much time to kill and players get frustrated very quickly ( im looking at you the division ) , to littel time to kill and the game dev's are not left with enoughf tools to kill/chalange the player ( this forces them into one shot mechanincs to chalange the player , like we have hear in PoE )

So for these 2 basic reason ( thares way more reason but i dont feel like explaining them ) the best of the best things in games WILL get nurfed , this is true in all western games . Eastern games offten do the opposit , but they do this for very diffrent reasons , ususaly to force people into buying power throught real curency , that's a topic for another day .

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SirSid wrote:

Eastern games offten do the opposit , but they do this for very diffrent reasons , ususaly to force people into buying power throught real curency , that's a topic for another day .

Have you not played a Korean MMO? Because GGG has taken more than a page from their book, they've taken entire chapters. There's a reason why "Korean" is synonymous with "soul-destroying grind" in most gaming circles.

gotta love people whining about endgame balance who don't get past t6 maps

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Apos91 wrote:

Why can't we buff the lesser skills for once?

And then ggg wonders why noone plays anything else other than EQ when it comes to melee.

Exactly!!! There are too numerous of threads on the whole "melee sucks compared to ranged" topic going back to last year and it's a damn good question to ask GGG why there hasn't been a major across the board buff on all melee skills (minus EQ) to get us to want to build around them. It's disgraceful for GGG to have not buffed up melee skills to bring them in line with ranged skills by now (should have done so by Perandus League).

GGG is known for some major imbalances but there's no reason most melee skills should be this bad.

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AkuTenshiiZero wrote:

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SirSid wrote:

Eastern games offten do the opposit , but they do this for very diffrent reasons , ususaly to force people into buying power throught real curency , that's a topic for another day .

Have you not played a Korean MMO? Because GGG has taken more than a page from their book, they've taken entire chapters. There's a reason why "Korean" is synonymous with "soul-destroying grind" in most gaming circles.

GGG grinding is based around having something for the player to do , and it's not that bad , Korean MMO grinding is based around the player paying cash to skip the grind , so they can get to another grind . It dose not make sence to most western gamers but this is 100% ok over thare . Also 90 % of estern games when they come to the west massivly change thare pay moddel's . Also game wealth carry over site are the norm in that area ( think D2jsp but WAY more common ) your wealth is carried over from game to game that's not the case in the west .

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Arrowneous wrote:

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Apos91 wrote:

Why can't we buff the lesser skills for once?

And then ggg wonders why noone plays anything else other than EQ when it comes to melee.

Exactly!!! There are too numerous of threads on the whole "melee sucks compared to ranged" topic going back to last year and it's a damn good question to ask GGG why there hasn't been a major across the board buff on all melee skills (minus EQ) to get us to want to build around them. It's disgraceful for GGG to have not buffed up melee skills to bring them in line with ranged skills by now (should have done so by Perandus League).

GGG is known for some major imbalances but there's no reason most melee skills should be this bad.

Fireball: 50% more damage.
Ice Spear: 70% more damage.
Arctic Breath: 35% more damage.
Cleave: 19% more damage.
Sweep: 15% more damage.
Ground Slam: 15% more damage.
Sunder: 9% more damage.
Viper Strike: 11% more damage.
Double Strike: 13% more damage.
Heavy Strike: 5% more damage.
Glacial Hammer: 6% more damage.
Dominating Blow: 6% more attack damage (not minion damage).
Frost Blades: 15% more damage.
Lightning Strike: 9% more damage.
Wild Strike: 19% more damage. It now also gains 1% increased area of effect per level.
Static Strike: 16% more damage.
Reave: 12% more damage. Reave's base area of effect has been increased by 21%. Its per-stage area of effect has been reduced from 30% to 20%. It still has the same area of effect at the fourth stage.
Vaal Reave's area of effect has been updated to match changes to Reave.
Lacerate's 30% Less Attack Speed drawback has been reduced to 25% Less Attack Speed. This is a buff.
Ice Crash's attack speed penalty is now 20% less (down from 25% less). Its secondary stage damage penalty is now 15% less (down from 20% less). Its third stage damage penalty is now 30% less (down from 40% less). This is a buff.
Static Strike now gains 1% increased area of effect per level.

Nope... no buffing lesser used skills at all...

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whitelytning wrote:

GGG doesn't need to change their view. You do.

You don't speak for the community. Very few people care about getting to 100.

I know I would care about level 100 (and Shaper, and Uber Lab, and etc.) if I thought it was an option for me. But GGG has gone out of their way to take that possibility away from the average player, and most above average players too.

And I get it... I understand the appeal behind "there should be some things out of reach for the average player, that only elite players can reach".

I just think it sucks.

I have fun in PoE, but I would have more fun if some of these "end game" goals were reachable.