Atlas mechanics / map drops: Is GGG lying to us? Deliberately not telling the truth?

Not a power player by any means but I have got a character up to Lv88. I alch all my t5 and above maps, I do Zana's dailies at LV8, etc. The highest map I have gotten has been a t13, most our 6 to 8.

My daughter plays and agrees that map drops suck. Why? Does GGG not want us to play? I mean I just don't get it.

I got no idea how you play maps, i run t12+ only chiseled,alched,vaaled, sometimes added frags and i got half tab of red maps already
Drops are insane, need nerf

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Kingoko wrote:

I got no idea how you play maps, i run t12+ only chiseled,alched,vaaled, sometimes added frags and i got half tab of red maps already
Drops are insane, need nerf

So how do you maintain chisels, vaals and fragments?

I don't chisel my T12 any more cause I don't have the chisels, running out of vaals as well (down from 95 to 20 in Standard).

Also why is it a problem that we got more maps to play now? Cause you cannot sell maps at the prices you could before?

"it will only drop maps that are adjacent or already unlocked on the atlas"

This change is a huge reason progressing through the atlas is so much slower, and future atlas's will be an abysmal grind. we all get stuck, because we can't ever skip ahead like we used to.
Until we unlock higher tiers, we can ONLY get +1. From chests, rares, bosses alike. And as the op questions.. what exactly does happen to that bosses +2? does it reroll? and thus explain why we keep getting t4's in a t10?, or does it stay current tier?

with 60% map clear "upgrade", and again, every rare+boss dropping +1,2, then my chances of getting a t11 should be high. (60% of every t10 from normal/rare/bosses, and every t11 from rare/bosses.) That does not seem to be the case at all.
While... it would explain alot if every t12 was getting rerolled.

While those buying maps to unlock the atlas, are having a better time. they are bypassing this gating mechanism.

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Casia wrote:

"it will only drop maps that are adjacent or already unlocked on the atlas"

This change is a huge reason progressing through the atlas is so much slower, and future atlas's will be an abysmal grind. we all get stuck, because we can't ever skip ahead like we used to.
Until we unlock higher tiers, we can ONLY get +1. From chests, rares, bosses alike. And as the op questions.. what exactly does happen to that bosses +2? does it reroll? and thus explain why we keep getting t4's in a t10?, or does it stay current tier?

with 60% map clear "upgrade", and again, every rare+boss dropping +1,2, then my chances of getting a t11 should be high. (60% of every t10 from normal/rare/bosses, and every t11 from rare/bosses.) That does not seem to be the case at all.
While... it would explain alot if every t12 was getting rerolled.

While those buying maps to unlock the atlas, are having a better time. they are bypassing this gating mechanism.

I think GGG should probably make it clearer how map drops work, and how the bonus affects this process. When you kill a mob, it rolls for loot. If the game determines that you get a map, the first thing it does is decide what tier you get. This could be anywhere from tier 1 up through the maximum tier that the dead mob can drop (+1 to current area from magic/rare mobs, +2 from bosses). Once it has decided the tier, it picks an available map from that tier, and you get your map. What the bonus does is it give you another roll that has the opportunity to upgrade the map +1/+2 tiers from the tier that the drop initially chose.

An example:
I Kill a map boss in a tier 9 map.
The game decides I get a map.
Game rolls tier. Tier chosen is 7.
Because my map bonus is 105% it automatically becomes a tier 8, with a 5% chance to roll to a tier 9.
The +2 roll fails, so I get a tier 8 map.
Game decides what tier 8 map I get, randomly from the tier 8 maps that I have unlocked.

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Char1983 wrote:

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morbo wrote:

I don't see what is so hard to understand. If you have 100% bonus, every map drop will be upgraded by +1, but of course this is limited by the usual drop restrictions: white mobs cant drop higher than +0, magic & rares cant drop higher than +1, bosses cant drop higher than +2.

OK and what happens if the determined tier cannot drop from the monster? Drop removed? Drop re-rolled? Tier capped? Unclear, no clear statement from GGG.

GGG's post says it's capped, which means that the bonus is simply ignored in such case and the map drops as is. If you have 100% Atlas bonus and get a +1 base drop from a blue mob, it doesnt become a +2 because that would break drop restrictions.

I can see how this bonus can be a bit confusing. Or more precisely: it's hard to evaluate its precise impact, because we don't know the underlying mechanics of map drops. Eg. how is base quantity selected, what are the chances that a certain tier drops, how everything scales through tiers, etc... GGG will prob. never release such info.

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So if that was true and the tier would just be capped, then we would all be swimming in T14/T15/T16 maps. Are you?

I'm swimming in T11/12. I don't see why would you expect a lot more T14+ maps? Even if you have 125% Atlas bonus, that just means all your drops are upgraded once to +1, if applicable and then you have another 25% chance to upgrade by another tier, if applicable.

The tiers are still randomly selected from T1 to T16, when you play in a T16 map and weighted toward lower tiers than the one you are playing in. All I can say is that progression through yellow maps in 2.5 was very smooth for me and that red ones "drop enough" or "slightly more than before". But that is just my biased experience, I could have been luckier than in the past and "there is no Atlas benefit". :)

E:
On average, if players were swimming in T9 before, they are swimming in T10 now, provided that they have 100%+ bonus and nothing else changed under the hood.

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morbo wrote:

GGG's post says it's capped, which means that the bonus is simply ignored in such case and the map drops as is. If you have 100% Atlas bonus and get a +1 base drop from a blue mob, it doesnt become a +2 because that would break drop restrictions.

No. That is the point. They don't say it is capped.

They say:

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Performing the bonus objective in each type of map unlocks a cumulative 1% chance for a map drop to upgrade by one tier. For example, if you have done this in 60 different types of maps, then you have a 60% chance that a map drop is upgraded by one tier. A chance higher than 100% means that the remainder is used to roll whether the upgrade is two tiers. The total bonus is displayed on the Atlas screen.

Actually, they do say "capped" at another point, which is weird cause I never read that word. However, I still doubt it is a simple cap.

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morbo wrote:

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So if that was true and the tier would just be capped, then we would all be swimming in T14/T15/T16 maps. Are you?

I'm swimming in T11/12. I don't see why would you expect a lot more T14+ maps? Even if you have 125% Atlas bonus, that just means all your drops are upgraded once to +1, if applicable and then you have another 25% chance to upgrade by another tier, if applicable.

Because I have run simulations. You may not realize it, but that Atlas bonus is a HUGE bonus. If you do not alter the map drops, it makes you sustain at least two tiers higher, easily, depending on the exact map drop formula. +1 to each map and +2 to 25% of maps, when capped, has about the same effect as buffing all map drops by 100%.

GGG nice joke is atlas,103% play T15 +vall+chisel+3 fragment=drop is 1 T14 lol



GGG pls nerf maps drop is to OP

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Char1983 wrote:

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morbo wrote:

GGG's post says it's capped, which means that the bonus is simply ignored in such case and the map drops as is. If you have 100% Atlas bonus and get a +1 base drop from a blue mob, it doesnt become a +2 because that would break drop restrictions.

No. That is the point. They don't say it is capped.

They say:

"

Performing the bonus objective in each type of map unlocks a cumulative 1% chance for a map drop to upgrade by one tier. For example, if you have done this in 60 different types of maps, then you have a 60% chance that a map drop is upgraded by one tier. A chance higher than 100% means that the remainder is used to roll whether the upgrade is two tiers. The total bonus is displayed on the Atlas screen.

Actually, they do say "capped" at another point, which is weird cause I never read that word. However, I still doubt it is a simple cap.

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morbo wrote:

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So if that was true and the tier would just be capped, then we would all be swimming in T14/T15/T16 maps. Are you?

I'm swimming in T11/12. I don't see why would you expect a lot more T14+ maps? Even if you have 125% Atlas bonus, that just means all your drops are upgraded once to +1, if applicable and then you have another 25% chance to upgrade by another tier, if applicable.

Because I have run simulations. You may not realize it, but that Atlas bonus is a HUGE bonus. If you do not alter the map drops, it makes you sustain at least two tiers higher, easily, depending on the exact map drop formula. +1 to each map and +2 to 25% of maps, when capped, has about the same effect as buffing all map drops by 100%.

Maintaining t11+ map pools without heavy currency investment is WAAAAAAY easier than it used to be once you have atlas filled out.

And I believe capped drops are more likely than capped + reroll based on that alone.

If we were in a position to be "swimming in t14/t15 maps" then GGG failed in what they were trying to achieve. Sorry but your model is likely lacking information or isn't quite right.

i only get t9 maps from zana, fuck i want to kill guardians not even close!