Just Realized Earthquake CoMK Storm Call just feels so right.

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PleiadesBlackstar wrote:

Hope the new bosses beat the piss and shit out of meta builds for assuming they can continue to stand still and facetank them just because they have 1million tooltip dps.

Unfortunately, if they're made to withstand 1mil dps and bump back, that means we will need to build afk tankers to do them and that it will take half an hour to do it, everyone else will just get either instagibbed or burn their potions until out of portals. I don't think they can fix it that easily at this point.

Balancing a game that has chars that do 10 or 20 times the dps of an average joe build and those that take 10 or 20 times less damage than one is a hell of a task. Might not even be realistically possible, devs say balance is a moving target, well, I say it's both moving and nearly out of range. Until they fix the gap we probably won't get content that's in everyone's challenge zone (or anything resembling a workable PvP, not good, mind you, just not utterly broken).

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raics wrote:

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PleiadesBlackstar wrote:

Hope the new bosses beat the piss and shit out of meta builds for assuming they can continue to stand still and facetank them just because they have 1million tooltip dps.

Unfortunately, if they're made to withstand 1mil dps and bump back, that means we will need to build afk tankers to do them and that it will take half an hour to do it, everyone else will just get either instagibbed or burn their potions until out of portals. I don't think they can fix it that easily at this point.

Balancing a game that has chars that do 10 or 20 times the dps of an average joe build and those that take 10 or 20 times less damage than one is a hell of a task. Might not even be realistically possible, devs say balance is a moving target, well, I say it's both moving and nearly out of range. Until they fix the gap we probably won't get content that's challenging for everybody to a reasonable extent (or anything resembling a workable PvP, not good, mind you, just not utterly broken).

I mean more so what I discussed in my other thread. Its fine to have these huge ass dps builds with the new bosses, but hopefully the boss damage like the new goat is enough to make any build dodge the leap slams that slows down the rate of fire for us characters.

I know that is very general and: 1) melee is still getting shit on from the looks of it unless there is a melee overhaul that doesn't effect ranged skills/builds *cough fortify cough* 2) that doesn't fix skills that simply need flat out improvements like elemental hit.

But not being able to do the essential of 1 shotting bosses without strong risk of dying due to outdpsing the bosses health faster than the boss can become a risk in a vast majority of cases feels wrong. If they buff the crap tier skills, find a means to fix only melee without improving ranged skills more on top of forcing all builds to not be brain dead without top tier items and investment then build diversity might actually be a thing. -.-

Anyway, probably not much left to discuss on EQ+SC. I'll try something if I get my hands on a Brainrattler or what not but I am predicting that the storm call portion may be a little... irrelevant.

Sure, dangerous bosses that can't be killed easily would be a step in the right direction if we're talking about providing challenge for broken builds. I'm just worried about the effect it might have on scrub population, I don't think the problem is in bosses, we have some pretty nice designs right now, which is evident if you play an underpowered build. The content isn't really all that bad, player capabilities are just off the charts, we have Goku running around in the same field as Choda Boy.

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PleiadesBlackstar wrote:

Anyway, probably not much left to discuss on EQ+SC. I'll try something if I get my hands on a Brainrattler or what not but I am predicting that the storm call portion may be a little... irrelevant.

Well, like I said before, you should feel the spells doing something but that's unfortunately only because you gimped EQ to do it. CoMK isn't unpopular because the support isn't doing anything, it does and it's effective at what it does, it's just that the whole thing is awkwardly implemented, has very little support in the rest of the game and it's pretty much pointless. That's coming from a CoMK fan, actually.

Mentioned it in a thread about CoC nerf, the bottom line was attack skill + 5 optimized dps supports on an attack focused build will trump same skill + spell + 3 universal supports on a hybrid build any day of the week. It was regarding the suggestion to rework CoC to always cast on crit but only once per skill use and detach it from the attack skill so any attack you use will trigger it. So, CoC could potentially trigger on every skill use and CoMK could trigger multiple times on one use if you kill multiple enemies, one is obviously focused on speed and the other one on high damage per hit. Looks pretty good in concept and should have a solid niche if they work out a few kinks.

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raics wrote:

Well, like I said before, you should feel the spells doing something but that's unfortunately only because you gimped EQ to do it. CoMK isn't unpopular because the support isn't doing anything, it does and it's effective at what it does, it's just that the whole thing is awkwardly implemented, has very little support in the rest of the game and it's pretty much pointless. That's coming from a CoMK fan, actually.

Mentioned it in a thread about CoC nerf, the bottom line was attack skill + 5 optimized dps supports on an attack focused build will trump same skill + spell + 3 universal supports on a hybrid build any day of the week. It was regarding the suggestion to rework CoC to always cast on crit but only once per skill use and detach it from the attack skill so any attack you use will trigger it. So, CoC could potentially trigger on every skill use and CoMK could trigger multiple times on one use if you kill multiple enemies, one is obviously focused on speed and the other one on high damage per hit, looks pretty good in concept if they work out a few kinks.

Yeah, I feel like if you find that middle ground where cast on melee kill physical attacks are enough but the spells actually help in some capacity would be nice but is self gimping. Like I was saying EQ with no COMK design meant behind the build was just making storm call look like a pretty aftereffect versus useful.

I like the coc and comk redesign you mentioned too, just got to wonder if it seems as balanceable as it sounds.

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PleiadesBlackstar wrote:

I like the coc and comk redesign you mentioned too, just got to wonder if it seems as balanceable as it sounds.

Probably not, things are rarely as balanceable as they sound here :)

But it does have much, much fewer points of exploit, you only need to worry about weapon attack speed and not the amount of hits skills do. For instance, multistrike is not a straight 100% dps multiplier for melee CoC, you don't get 5-6 spells per barrage or KB salvo, won't see ten discharges per second on cyclone, less ruckus on screen overall - parties happy.

Just realized that while it may be ditching CoMK, duel wielding mjolner would probably be a lot more viable for this as long as I pack them full of storm calls and figure out which supports make it most beneficial. I haven't had much experience with mjolner besides rainbow nuke but I have 2 spare mjolner in standard to mess with...

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dudiobugtron wrote:

CoMK isn't really endgame viable, since you need to kill bosses, and CoMK sucks against most bosses. Unless you had a separate single-target skill (spell or melee) and just used CoMK for clearing.

Does seem like a pretty cool combo though in terms of the timing of the skills. The support gem synergy is really nice too.
I guess you did EQ - CoMK - Storm Call - Less Duration - Conc Effect/Inc AoE - Lightning penetration?

With bone rattler maybe swap out conc effect for Phys to lightning.

Doryani's fist would be ideal, but sadly it won't work with Earthquake :(

just a few responses to various points in this:


-You use CoMK as the clearing tool, generally, and bring along another setup for bosskilling. As a result, you'd usually wanna go 2hander for CoMK, cuz you definitely want a 5+L for CoMK and without a 2hander you're stuck using a 4L for bosskilling (though you can make that work; I used Rime Gaze on my Dory's Fist CoMK to get a pseudo-5L bosskiller, and it could be even better as a Hierophant)

-In truth, Storm Call doesn't really work out great for CoMK. It positions the bolts where the enemies died, so you wind up striking down on the already-deceased kinda pointlessly. CoMK tends to work better with radial or conical spells (I'd like to try it with SRS/summons too, if only there was a way to get summons to be unable to kill enemies like Southbound allows players to do)

-Dory's Fist winds up being a pretty ideal CoMK 'weapon' for the most part, aside from the limited attack skills available and the fact that you have to use a 4L to bosskill (although Dory's base damage is like getting a free WED gem on every attack, so it's a little more like a 5L anyway). You could use Ice Crash with it instead, though obviously then there's no effect for Less Duration. I guess if you really want that, you could try Infernal Blow instead to still get Less Duration (ideally with Slayer to get a free melee splash and a boatload of aoe).

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SIQI wrote:

Cyclone - Phys to lit - COMK - Blade vortex - Bladefall - ICS(If inquisitor)/LitPen(if not inquisitor)

Blade Vortex doesn't really meld with CoMK cylcone; what you quickly wind up seeing is the blade vortex stealing a bunch of the kills from cylcone, resulting in not really building up as many spell casts as you'd like; it's not quite the same as using CoC with those two. Same problem I had when I tried a cyclone-comk-discharge setup with RF... RF kept taking the kills.

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Shppy wrote:

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dudiobugtron wrote:

CoMK isn't really endgame viable, since you need to kill bosses, and CoMK sucks against most bosses. Unless you had a separate single-target skill (spell or melee) and just used CoMK for clearing.

Does seem like a pretty cool combo though in terms of the timing of the skills. The support gem synergy is really nice too.
I guess you did EQ - CoMK - Storm Call - Less Duration - Conc Effect/Inc AoE - Lightning penetration?

With bone rattler maybe swap out conc effect for Phys to lightning.

Doryani's fist would be ideal, but sadly it won't work with Earthquake :(

just a few responses to various points in this:


-You use CoMK as the clearing tool, generally, and bring along another setup for bosskilling. As a result, you'd usually wanna go 2hander for CoMK, cuz you definitely want a 5+L for CoMK and without a 2hander you're stuck using a 4L for bosskilling (though you can make that work; I used Rime Gaze on my Dory's Fist CoMK to get a pseudo-5L bosskiller, and it could be even better as a Hierophant)

-In truth, Storm Call doesn't really work out great for CoMK. It positions the bolts where the enemies died, so you wind up striking down on the already-deceased kinda pointlessly. CoMK tends to work better with radial or conical spells (I'd like to try it with SRS/summons too, if only there was a way to get summons to be unable to kill enemies like Southbound allows players to do)

-Dory's Fist winds up being a pretty ideal CoMK 'weapon' for the most part, aside from the limited attack skills available and the fact that you have to use a 4L to bosskill (although Dory's base damage is like getting a free WED gem on every attack, so it's a little more like a 5L anyway). You could use Ice Crash with it instead, though obviously then there's no effect for Less Duration. I guess if you really want that, you could try Infernal Blow instead to still get Less Duration (ideally with Slayer to get a free melee splash and a boatload of aoe).

I was finding storm call had plenty of radius to hit other enemies. when you synergize radius for both skills, it is the irrelevancy of killing everything in t9 maps with just the earthquake and the storm call just hits the ground doing nothing.

Like I posted, mjolner might be my fix for this instead of comk.

I was trying to think of ways to make this work. I thought EQ + SC was a good idea until someone said that the storm calls target where the white mobs die. In terms of other CoMK support synergies, I was thinking maybe Molten Strike + Summon Raging Spirit? Focus fire the Blues/Yellows with Molten Strike and count on the projectiles to do some damage, and raging spirits to clean up the rest. Added Fire and Faster Attacks would be good with both parts.