I feel like we're being a little too harsh to GGG

"

AkuTenshiiZero wrote:

My logic is that this game has a core player base of less than 10k, because that's what's left after the hype wears off and the people who temporarily play filter out. It's the number of people who are consistently playing this game, and are thus a more consistent source of revenue. If you're the kind of person who pays for what amounts to a fancy banner on the forums every three months for a game you don't even consistently play, then I'm sorry but you're perpetuating a financial system that has never worked long-term and cannot be sustained.

And if you're going to deliberately misuse player stats, then I'm sorry but that's about as clear a case of white knighting as I've ever seen, and I'm not gonna waste any more effort on you.

I am consistently playing the game, I've been doing that for almost 4 years now. Also you're the one who is making false connections between CCU and being a "loyal player" (whatever that means), I'm just calling you out on it. You still haven't explained how GGG has been able to grow to 50+ employees over the past 3 years with their, as you claim, unsustainable financial system.

Im not that good at math .

But i am good at telling witch number is bigger than the other.


http://store.steampowered.com/stats/

Pulled off this site as i write the post.

9,135 16,100 Path of Exile


6,622 10,902 DARK SOULS III


6,186 12,722 Tom Clancy's Rainbow Six Siege


3,945 6,701 Tom Clancy's The Division


3,481 12,648 Call of Duty: Black Ops III


2,607 5,410 DOOM


1,981 3,893 Elite Dangerous


1,675 3,143 Grim Dawn


Clearly PoE is dead RIP GGG.
Lets look at some games that are beating POE on this chart shall we


452,628 890,751 Dota 2

159,911 558,645 Counter-Strike: Global Offensive

37,573 66,742 Team Fortress 2

24,858 45,100 Rocket League

ok so mass budget E-sports games that have HUGE followings world wide


24,465 50,907 Garry's Mod

20,710 38,630 The Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim

19,600 30,514 Fallout 4

14,618 38,333 Arma 3

11,108 23,359 The Witcher 3: Wild Hunt

Games that can be mod'ed and have huge fan bases with AAA advertising budget's also 1 time pay games .


But im sure PoE is dead and GGG is going bankrupt .

"

Pewzor wrote:

So using the total steam PoE account figure, ~5% of the players logged in over 2 weeks and 0.5% of the players actually played today *on steam*. This is not a good number following a new league release.

That number has been working out quite well for GGG over the last 3,5 years. Why do you assume that the number is bad?

"

AkuTenshiiZero wrote:

"

Xavderion wrote:

Wrong. It only makes sense to use the two week chart to check how many active players there are at the moment. CCU tells us very little about that. Following your logic, as soon as I leave the game and go to sleep I'm not a loyal player anymore? Doesn't make any sense.

My logic is that this game has a core player base of less than 10k, because that's what's left after the hype wears off and the people who temporarily play filter out. It's the number of people who are consistently playing this game, and are thus a more consistent source of revenue. If you're the kind of person who pays for what amounts to a fancy banner on the forums every three months for a game you don't even consistently play, then I'm sorry but you're perpetuating a financial system that has never worked long-term and cannot be sustained.

And if you're going to deliberately misuse player stats, then I'm sorry but that's about as clear a case of white knighting as I've ever seen, and I'm not gonna waste any more effort on you.

Why dose GGG need to be making money off us constantly to survive ? most of the games on that list are 1 time buy games that never see any more income a few weeks after launch till they build and put out a whole new game .

A core player base of 10 k players that log in evrey day seems like alot to me , however looking at the stat page you linked http://steamcharts.com/app/238960
you are showing a peak of 10 k USERS ONLINE and a low avrage of 5 k USERS ONLINE , so that's 24 houres a day .

How many individual people each day logging in is that ? if the avrage during a slow time is say 5 k players online then is that 20k or 50 k or 100k diffrent people during the day ? and how many people only get to play evrey few days or so ? some people can only log on at the week end .

"

AkuTenshiiZero wrote:

"

Xavderion wrote:

Wrong. It only makes sense to use the two week chart to check how many active players there are at the moment. CCU tells us very little about that. Following your logic, as soon as I leave the game and go to sleep I'm not a loyal player anymore? Doesn't make any sense.

My logic is that this game has a core player base of less than 10k, because that's what's left after the hype wears off and the people who temporarily play filter out. It's the number of people who are consistently playing this game, and are thus a more consistent source of revenue. If you're the kind of person who pays for what amounts to a fancy banner on the forums every three months for a game you don't even consistently play, then I'm sorry but you're perpetuating a financial system that has never worked long-term and cannot be sustained.

And if you're going to deliberately misuse player stats, then I'm sorry but that's about as clear a case of white knighting as I've ever seen, and I'm not gonna waste any more effort on you.

That's not entirely true, there are a lot of players who start each temp league, play for a few weeks or a month and then do other stuff until the next league shows up. And they've been doing this for years. This is mostly what causes the huge player swings. You can't take the lowest player count as a baseline.

Also using the numbers for the past 2 weeks for PoE baseline is also flawed. PoE players fluctuate between a piss poor 4k to 16k/day on steam depending on time of league.

Basically PoE has decent player retention power for about 5 weeks every 3 months. This is also the reason why GGG is now releasing supporters pack right before league release now. They use to only do this when they release major expansions like awakening and ascendancy... but not anymore... they released prophecy supporters pack for a temp league this time. I can see them continue doing it. This basically means GGG will have more motivation to push out leagues as fast as possible, and as often as possible... which is a double edged sword... QA? Testing? Stability? often becomes an after thought.

Just wanted to say that with my old PC, performance with the steam client is abysmal. So i switched back to the standalone client.

Maybe some thousand other players, too?

Also peak concurrent players sounds skewed, because time zones.
Also i'm not playing right now because real life and i'm still loyal ;)
Just some things to consider when throwing around random numbers and building some "Game is ded"-theories.

"

Antaiseito wrote:

Just wanted to say that with my old PC, performance with the steam client is abysmal. So i switched back to the standalone client.

Maybe some thousand other players, too?

Could be, we can't really make any definite conclusions without numbers from all clients and realms.

However, unreliable numbers aside, there's one thing that concerns me - it's the shape of the graph, numbers show the amount and shape shows tendencies. So, if you check the steam chart you notice one thing, for previous content releases the player bleed curve was convex and it was definitely concave for Ascendancy.

So what could that mean?

I'm no data analyst, but it might be something like this:
convex curve - players bleed away after completing their goal in new league, whatever it may be
concave curve - players dip their fingers in, go 'eek, cold' and drop out

Hey OP - just though I'd add that I liked your idea behind the thread :D

Sorry it seemed to get derailed so soon. Happens a lot apparently.

"

raics wrote:

I'm no data analyst, but it might be something like this:
convex curve - players bleed away after completing their goal in new league, whatever it may be
concave curve - players dip their fingers in, go 'eek, cold' and drop out

Sounds quite right, but notice that the concave curve started much higher than the previous convex curves and then kinda balanced out with previous curves.

Seems to me on first glance that it was rather more hype/public spotlight than before, so more people tried the game at once at the start of a new league.

Also i agree with firefoxsilver ;)