I feel like we're being a little too harsh to GGG

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Pyrokar wrote:
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Phrazz wrote:
YES, GGG makes mistakes. YES, we have the right to talk about/point out their mistakes.

But what the fuck ever happened to constructive criticism? What happened to discussions? What we see on the forums today isn't feedback. It isn't productive criticism. It's whining! And name calling. And entitled idiots.

So funny :D

Spoiler


Irony? I'm part of of the problem, never said anything else. Where's the irony?
Sometimes, just sometimes, you should really consider adapting to the world, instead of demanding that the world adapts to you.
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Phrazz wrote:
But what the fuck ever happened to constructive criticism? What happened to discussions? What we see on the forums today isn't feedback. It isn't productive criticism. It's whining!

Over the years we have seen tons of carefully assembled feedback and insightful threads. Most of those haven't even got a 'we're aware of the issue and plan to rectify it at some point / we're happy with the way it works out and don't think it's a problem'. Manifestos are all well and good but are a very impersonal way to do things, as a result we don't really know what devs think on a variety of issues that concern the community, especially if you aren't willing to dig through podcasts before providing your feedback.

It's just too easy to feel as if you're throwing your words down a wishing well and getting not even a tiny little splash in return for your trouble. We have a bunch of threads about same old issues all over again because the ones before got no official response so we have no bloody idea what devs actually think about it, and we have less and less people even bothering to comment on them because they already did it a few times before. If you're serious about collaborating with your community you will have someone doing the actual communication, someone that's privy to both current development focus as well as longterm plans and can provide a better feedback to the feedback than 'thank you for your trouble'.

Now, I do think GGG has a much better interaction with their community than most other developers out there, however those don't even pretend to take consumer feedback seriously. In other words, the current communication level is very good for 'we don't give a fuck' policy, but poor if your official stance is 'we expect our playerbase to work with us in creating the ultimate aRPG experience'.
Wish the armchair developers would go back to developing armchairs.

◄[www.moddb.com/mods/balancedux]►
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Last edited by raics on Jun 20, 2016, 12:32:20 PM
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Bars wrote:
The threads are hostile because GGG is making mistakes which could have been forgivable to an indie producer with a newfound success a few years ago but are looking less and less excusable as time goes by.

- yet another league plagued by technical difficulties: GGG used a closed beta pre-awakening but made the players actually pay to betatest their content and didn't listen to a word said in the closed beta feedback forum, which understandable lead to a massive backlash. They overreacted in a typical fashion and, instead of making a free open beta a few weeks before the leagues after that and actually listening to player feedback, stopped doing betas whatsoever.

- the majority of players hates the lab and Chris calls them a 'vocal minority' and introduces even more lab, and a much more fucked-up one, in the next patch (where am I getting my data? EVERYWHERE. All my friends ingame I've talked to, yes, the stupid straw poll, the general atmosphere in the forum, my own conclusions - everything points that way)

- the XP grind past 90 was ridiculous even before and almost no one had the patience for it - GGG rapes XP gain after 90, Havoc says he won't level to 100 in the new league (if I were in GGG's shoes, I would treat that as a major disaster btw)

- players are more powerful than ever with the 8 ascendancy points... and they have no content to run, red maps don't drop, yellow maps give no fucking XP, uber atziri is gated behind layers and layers of farming and RNG, even the uber lab is gated for the few people who like running it

- they add even more random spike damage in the game - I don't know what they did to normal monster damage but my map buddies and I regularly experience white mobs in t11-12 maps, without too rippy mods, hitting for 5-6 k. Perhaps they upped monster crit multi? Yesterday in a spings map a white viper literally oneshot me at 5700 hp. I returned to the map and just tried his damage, he was hitting for ~2500 with normal (ranged and unavoidable!) attacks, so perhaps the oneshot was a crit? Do I really have to explain for the 10th time why having such huge and random damage spikes from unpredictable sources is bad game design?


... and I could go on and on. So, yes, players have a lot to complain about and they are doing it. You can tell when the league is successful - the forum is much more peaceful. There are and there will always be negative threads but the + to - ratio is much different.


POE is still the undisputed king of ARPGs but your criticisms are on point. Completely agree.
IGN: JerleNecroDD/JerleNecroRuthless
Harvest is the BEST league EVER. Deterministic crafting ftw.
How will POE2 and POE coexist?
The only major thing I can complain about is the performance of this game. I used to play on max settings back in 1.0.2 and the only problems were desync and some fps spikes which I got after opening strongboxes that spawned a lot of monsters + an exile.

Nowadays, after purchasing a new GPU and tweaking some other stuff, I'm down to ~25-40 fps while fighting with huge fps spikes all over the place. Certain maps/ground effects always cause periodic fps spikes for me so I need to play on low settings to be able to have a somewhat smooth game experience.
This is a buff.
Last edited by ApE_EmPeROR on Jun 20, 2016, 12:39:39 PM
I think GGG is cool with us talking and criticising stuff. I also don't think that anyone giving feedback seems harmful to GGG however heated his/her feedback might be.

We cool GGG, right?
I'm a forum warrior, i was born to post, raised to defend my league. Now my post has been removed, chained and exiled by mods who Ban. Ban is my brother; i do not fear it. I see it in the eyes of men and beasts that i troll. It will take me to play the actual game when i am ready and i am not ready.
I don't. Enough is enough. Stop the fleecing.
Don't forget to drink your milk 👌
Yeah prolly. Problem is, as games age, boredom steps in so we are starting with a poor attitude no matter what they do. And when it's really bad choices we go really off.

Bars brings up most of the bad choices

Map RNG no content to run has always been a long standing bad choice. I've done uber maybe 200x. But found exactly 2 hopes in my career. lucky i can flip eh? Most ppl either don't want to or cant and are stuck face rolling yellows 99% of thier career. Terrible end game. I've always hated it and no new found salty there.

EXP i dont care about really. 90 is all I need to do any OP build this game has. I'm utilitarian that way. But a lot of ppl do care. Terrible move to make it harder to level.

Lab. LOL anyone who says they like it must be a bot with no human feelings.
Git R Dun!
Last edited by Aim_Deep on Jun 20, 2016, 2:25:03 PM
Depends. If you're affected by the disconnects/crashes and literally can't play the game you have a right to be angry. Everything else though? People are jaded after hundreds or even thousands of hours playing a game, that's how it always goes.
GGG banning all political discussion shortly after getting acquired by China is a weird coincidence.
We are hard on them cuz we love them . We know they can take it .


I feel sometimes in this game i feel people greatly overreact to changes before they fully flesh them out + thares starting to be alot of stuff in this game and chances are getting higher that 1 or 2 things will no apeal to every player .

I try to stay away from teck problem threads with this game since i run a insane rig / with super crappy internet , so the way i expereince PoE is vastly diffrent than most players . 1440 or 4 k ( ususaly 1440 since 4k gives me a head acke ) max setting / holds 60 no problem / predictive mode . I disabel 1 card and run max overclock on a singile card , load game off a 4 SSD drive raid zero configeration . So yha i don't really have much of a leg to stand on in threads like that since less than 1 % of people have a simmilar set up to mine .

I love the lab , can't understand why people don't like it ( i think it's cuz it's diffrent ) but i don't go into lab hate threads and spew my opinion cuz i feel it's diffrent people may have vastly diffrent experences in it than I do .

leveling past 90 is a massive time sink with HUGE diminishing returns , not a problem at all and i feel good for the long term health of the game . No problem hear at all , deal with it .

Power creep on the other hand is very real and we talk about it alot since it potentialy can be a big problem and snowball quick.

PoE is random damage spike , random damage spikes are PoE . I feel we have all been so strong the last few patches ( auto pilot farming god mode engaged ) we forgot that , keeping an eye on it but not really newes to me .


Just a sec let me grab a beer...@#*@ Ok how did I die this time

Learn the rules, it's the only way to exploit them.
It's a public forum. You're going to get whatever the public puts out. Right now, the mood in the forum is such that people who wish to praise something feel bullied out of the discussion. So they don't post. So it appears that everyone is being "too harsh" when really most players are just avoiding confrontation.

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