Oldy but a goodie

Have to chime in, this discussion is getting out of hand.

One of THE most important things for melee in pvp is the offhand swap. What good does voidheart do when your offhand is EA or something not melee? What, you are going to weapon swap AND swap rings at the same time?

For pve, voidheart + 870dps axe might come out ontop. But in pvp, losing that one ring slot will gimp you pretty hard; having to make up the lost resistances/life/flat phys/attributes is devastatingly difficult to fill with jewels, especially for min/max builds. Why settle for lesser stats on jewels JUST so you can use that one ring? Not a good trade.

Want the best axe? Get ahfack's. Want tooltip warrior or pve clear speed? Get a bow.

And ahfack, stop writing essays.

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gump124 wrote:

Want the best axe? Get ahfack's. Want tooltip warrior or pve clear speed? Get a bow.

Well said.

Haha Yeah I'm longwinded as fuck, ive tried to work on it to no avail lol

"

Dude you're being creepy.

I have a full time job and a family and this is a game, clearly all you have is your pile of pixels and thread stalking.

Gain a little perspective about priorities in life, but no matter what I say that will not help you.

Post a video of you doing t15 maps with no chest and come talk to me about who has skill or not. I'll be waiting. Take as long as you need I'm patient.


Clearly you feel threatened and/or are bored to tears because no one is mirroring your CoC dagger because everyone fears the nerf train, but then again if you actually played the game you'd know that maps have turned into the "run behind the bv/coc guy" and CoC is gonna get nerfed at some point for sure.

lol So many people are complaining of me being afk so frequently, and you talking like you know im 7/24 in this game. Why you ppl always like to accuse others of doing something that you dont not even sure? Thats wat a fan of logic should do?

chill out, dude Im not saying that you're unskilled. you're a No.1 pvp on ladder, that's enough to prove you do have a strong skill in pvp. BUT That doesnt mean you know better than other players, this is just the truth.

This is insane, I have no idea why you start to talk about CoC here... Why you care more than i do about my coc dagger that doesnt belong to u? But to answer you, I dont feel anything change, ppl still copy it. So again, another false accusation.

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So here's the deal, forget everything we have said before. After asking GGG, here is how Rapid Decay works:

If you can support your melee skill with Rapid Decay, it will also benefit DoTs created by this skill.

EQ is a duration skill, so therefore Rapid Decay (when used with Earthquake) will boost DoT from every source: Voidheart, Bleed from Weapon, Bleed/Poison from Tree, Poison from Gloves, and any other source that gives your supported attack DoT with Rapid Decay.

I was originally told, by multiple people smarter than I, that Rapid Decay has to be linked to a DoT GEM in order to boost it, that's why I used poison + Rapid Decay, and I was under the impression that Rapid Decay was only significantly boosting the poison from the poison gem, and not also the bleed. Until voidheart came out a few weeks ago, no one had tested otherwise and I've had this axe much longer than the voidheart has existed, so this is all still very brand new stuff.

Correct, but I alrdy clarified those mechanism interactions in my previous posts. I just want to hear you to confess you were wrong about it. In my expectation, you are just making excuses to avoid admitting your negligence. thats pathetic.

"

Until Earthquake, there were only 2 other red melee skills that had duration tags, Static Strike and Dominating Blow. Both skills you wouldn't really use Rapid Decay with. Combine a new skill with a support gem you wouldn't ordinarily use with a melee skill, combined with an even newer ring, and of course there will be confusion with some of the mechanics, so this is where all the confusion came from.

So now, what is trying to be discussed is, which is better? Old mirrored Axe + Voidheart, or just my Axe? The short answer is: It depends on what you want.

OMG.. I thought you were pretending not to understand, now I think you really dont understand wat we're talking about here.
Why you keep talking about other skills? Wasnt you the one focusing on earthquake first? Isnt your PVP guide focusing on earthquake? Aren't all of your demo video's using earthquake?
Why would people use static strike / dominating blow for pvp?
How many players would use those two skills in pve? If EQ is current tier1 skill, wat tier those skills are? I would say tier 3 or 4. How many time should I repeat? Im comparing ur 710pdps axe to 870pdps axe with the concept of your build. Please stop confusing here and answer the simple question, Is 870pdps axe better than 710pdps bleeding axe for EQ build or not?

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First off, let's get this out of the way first, Brimstone Bane is #2 old 2H axe with 860pdps, strength and LGoH.

Pain Sunder is #1 with 879pdps and Crit/Multi

So if you are going to go with an old axe and rely on voidheart 24/7, then there's no point in getting a Brimstone Bane. No matter if someone chooses my axe or the best old axe, Brimstone Bane still isn't the answer - Sorry, but that's fact and not opinion. There is no use for Brimstone Bane as long as Pain Sunder is around.

Same case as you mentioned my coc dagger again, Why you care more about brimstone bane than I do? I never mentioned it in ur thread (only once in my first post, but I alrdy removed it and made a clarification that doing advertise in your thread is unneccesarily to me.) But I think I have to defend for it to against your false accusation here:
I took some screenshots, basically, I simulated your tree (almost same), and I tried 2 setup (with abyssus, and w/o). Brimstone bane is up, Painsunder is down.

First setup is w/o abyssus, Brimstone bane 33987pdps, Pain sunder is 34030pdps.


Second setup is w/ abyssus, Brimstone bane 37057pdps, Pain sunder is 37055pdps.

The differences are almost neglectable, but dont forget Brimstone Bane provides 25life and 5LGOH. In this case, I think there's no reason for you not to use Brimstone Bane.
If you run a crit build with 2H axe, ofc Pain sunder is the beast.
(I never said Brimstone Bane is best. did i? )
But if its a RT build, Brimstone bane wins.
So I guess you're wrong again, Mr. No.1 pvper?

Again, explaining these thing above wasnt my intention, unneccesarily at all, Pain sunder had got copied 44 times before brimstone Bane came up. Now Pain sunder still stays at 44 (if jin's thread update correctly). Brimstone bane has alrdy got a fairly good amount of copies, which is absolutely more than urs. I didnt even waste any time to ad it in game. So I dont know why you think in that way? There's no reason for me to take ur axe into consideration. Believe me, the main reason that ppl copy ur axe is for your title of No.1 pvp on ladder. how many copies you will get depends on how many fans you have. (I'll stop here, totally offtopic)

I alrdy clarified many times in this thread, that i came here just for one reason. I wanted to discuss about ur old comment on voidheart, and also if your axe is Bis for pvp/pve or not. More specifically, I think your comment/explanation were totally misleading ppl, and I wanted to make you confess it.

Fortunately, voidheart finally becomes an "Incredible unique" in your comment. It shows my efforts were not in vain.

"

Now that that's out of the way, you mentioned what we're talking about is Pain Sunder + Voidheart Vs. Hate Splitter + Rare Ring. First off, you can't compare a rare ring to a build-enabling unique. That's like saying, "Hey man my Skyforths are better than your tri res boots!" They both accomplish completely different things.

What you can accurately compare between two items is what sort of an effect using said unique has on the rest of your build; What must the rest of your gear/tree contain to make up for that lost spot?

Ya, ofc we cant compare a unique ring to a rare ring. But pls stop pretending to not understand. Im always talking about the tradeoff, google it if you dont understand. We can always tell if the tradeoff is good or not.

Let me bring it up again, you need to spend 4 suffixes and 1 prefiex on jewel to make back the loss of a rare ring. (make back the res and life)

Wat prefix you'r supposed to take if you have the rare ring? I would say 16% phys damage or 8% ias
Wat suffixes you'r supposed to take if you have the rare ring? I'd say 5%ias or 12%dmg

So, It's more clear now, literally, If you wear voidheart, you gain 22% more tooltip dmg and a free socket in 6L, but the loss is one of (16%dmg, 8%ias) and four of (5%ias, 12%dmg).

Not to mention, you still have a rare ring, belt, boots, gloves. Theoretically, you can alrdy cap your res at 135 (or even cap at 180 if you're gears are good enough, Its not a dream cause we're talking about a pvp build in std). So, now, Can you answer if the tradeoff is good?

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I revised my thoughts on voidheart on my 1st page, and reason number 4 about my axe I think I'll post here because it pertains to this:

4. Un-nerfable: Voidheart is a really incredible ring, but what does the future hold? As I post this, it hasn't even been out for 1 month yet, and reddit is already blowing up with people saying Voidheart is OP. Think long term with your mirror weapon. These days, GGG seems to prefer global nerfs on uniques, like what they did with the voltaxic recently (100%->60% global nerf, now no one uses it). If you get a more expensive 870pdps axe that relies on a unique ring, what if the ring gets a global nerf later? What if EQ gets a massive nerf, and you want to go back to Cyclone and don't have the +2 range? If that happened, you would be better off with an Atziri Disfavour, and that would be really unfortunate.

Earthquake is still a relatively new skill, and if there are nerfs in it's future it is the smartest option to have an axe that is BiS for both old and new meta skills.

This is... ridiculous bro, you want me to point this out?
Literally, you're the one get frightened of voidheart, cause it makes your axe no more valuable. So wat you're doing now is threatening ppl "hoho voidheart will get nerfed, my axe is best choice." Sigh, Why you always do some accusations that you dont even know? even the accusation about the future thing... GG.

Anyway, you can keep finding some other guys/friends to do vouches for you in ur thread, but it wont change the fact. Look at those vouches on ur first page, 3 of them is in my guild. I bet you wont want to hear wat we have talked in our guild chat. (Ill stop here, I dont want to break your relationships.)

Hahaha you just don't understand and it's okay :) but I'm so sorry that you're so angry :( cheer up!

You don't see me on your threads littering them up, and I didn't ask anyone that's posted here to come here.

If you a want best clear speed go bow, if you want 100% Most DPS with eq, then go crit with abyssus and a mirror staff, you wouldn't even use an axe. New op skills and uniques get nerfed all the time don't know what game you been playing, and global nerfs could be the way they're handling the uniques now. That's real player discussion, not just me.

I got nothing else for ya my man. Have a good day!

"

gump124 wrote:

Have to chime in, this discussion is getting out of hand.

One of THE most important things for melee in pvp is the offhand swap. What good does voidheart do when your offhand is EA or something not melee? What, you are going to weapon swap AND swap rings at the same time?

For pve, voidheart + 870dps axe might come out ontop. But in pvp, losing that one ring slot will gimp you pretty hard; having to make up the lost resistances/life/flat phys/attributes is devastatingly difficult to fill with jewels, especially for min/max builds. Why settle for lesser stats on jewels JUST so you can use that one ring? Not a good trade.

Want the best axe? Get ahfack's. Want tooltip warrior or pve clear speed? Get a bow.

And ahfack, stop writing essays.

First of all, finally a guy know the truth that voidheart + 870dps axe is best for pve.

That's a good arugement here. I alrdy explained that the tradeoff is like a ring for 4suffixes (to make back the resist loss) and 1preifx (to make back the life loss) on jewel. I dont want to explain more detail here.

Today, In pvp, you're supposed to get four 12% dot suffixes on jewel if you're offhand is EA. (You cant find any good prefix that synergize with both main/off hand, then we neglect prefix here.)
It turns out that you lose 48% dot dmg in both ur main/off hand if you use voidheart, But you gain like 30~40% more total dmg in your main hand EQ.

Im not pretty sure if the tradeoff is good, cause I dont pvp. You tell me.

"

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gump124 wrote:

Want the best axe? Get ahfack's. Want tooltip warrior or pve clear speed? Get a bow.

Well said.

Haha Yeah I'm longwinded as fuck, ive tried to work on it to no avail lol

Cut off the part that bad for you, but quote the last word out of context. Good job man, keep working.

"

Hahaha you just don't understand and it's okay :) but I'm so sorry that you're so angry :( cheer up!

You don't see me on your threads littering them up, and I didn't ask anyone that's posted here to come here.

If you a want best clear speed go bow, if you want 100% Most DPS with eq, then go crit with abyssus and a mirror staff, you wouldn't even use an axe. New op skills and uniques get nerfed all the time don't know what game you been playing, and global nerfs could be the way they're handling the uniques now. That's real player discussion, not just me.

I got nothing else for ya my man. Have a good day!

You get no aruement here, you just keep confusing, avoiding the question i asked (If 870pdps better than urs or not).

Ya I never see you in my thread cause I never use false information to mislead ppl. thats the reason :)

"I didn't ask anyone that's posted here to come here", Oh please stop, I rly dont want to break your relationships. But i can if you ask me to link the chat log. If you still want to save your face, leave it alone.

And ya, the only thing you can do is hoping GGG nerf voidheart. there's nothing you can do, nothing you can say. You dont even have the balls to confess you were wrong.

"

aphrodite_1289 wrote:

First of all, finally a guy know the truth that voidheart + 870dps axe is best for pve.

I said "might be", not best. Don't misquote me.

"

aphrodite_1289 wrote:

Im not pretty sure if the tradeoff is good, cause I dont pvp. You tell me.

This part is important, you don't pvp. Answer is no, trade off is not good. He advertised the axe as pvp/pve, with pvp focus. He only recently added some pve parts because people asked for it.

Voidheart is a good item, no doubt. But it's meant as build-enabling rather than complimenting people with high end gear. You can achieve similar results by using axe+voidheart, and try making up the losses with jewels, but that's going the extra mile and a half to imitate what the bleed axe does...

And as for jewels, the perfect mods for both the bleed axe and axe+voidheart are exactly the same (Life/phys axe/area dmg/all res), so you are not "making back the losses due to ring", you are simply losing stats.

If a build has the EXACT same tree and gear, minus axe + ring, then ahfack's axe wins out in the end simply because he gets that extra ring slot. Sure, the axe+voidheart will have slightly higher dmg, but I would always take that extra ring slot over dmg any day.

Thanks man!

Made another copy today, thanks for all the bumps!



Sickest axe. First time mirroring it since I got the Dragon Spear MTX :D

Bump!

dat zoom in, G fkn G

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gump124 wrote:

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aphrodite_1289 wrote:

First of all, finally a guy know the truth that voidheart + 870dps axe is best for pve.

I said "might be", not best. Don't misquote me.

Sorry my bad.
But according to my logic, you, as a friend of OP, should've left a positive vouch just like all those funny vouch in first page (no matter its fake or not) about OP's axe. Instead, you left a relatively true comment that "870pdps axe+voidheart might be the ontop". So that was the reason I thought in that way.
How about this, I consider it as "OP's 710pdps bleeding axe is not the best for pve."
for pvp? we can talk about it below.

"

gump124 wrote:

"

aphrodite_1289 wrote:

Im not pretty sure if the tradeoff is good, cause I dont pvp. You tell me.

This part is important, you don't pvp. Answer is no, trade off is not good. He advertised the axe as pvp/pve, with pvp focus. He only recently added some pve parts because people asked for it.

Voidheart is a good item, no doubt. But it's meant as build-enabling rather than complimenting people with high end gear. You can achieve similar results by using axe+voidheart, and try making up the losses with jewels, but that's going the extra mile and a half to imitate what the bleed axe does...

And as for jewels, the perfect mods for both the bleed axe and axe+voidheart are exactly the same (Life/phys axe/area dmg/all res), so you are not "making back the losses due to ring", you are simply losing stats.

You're losing logic here. First of all, OP doesnt need any res on jewel with his own setup.

In his gears, he has 2 rare rings, 1 rare belt, 1 rare glove, 1 rare boots. How much all res is that? Theorectically 225 all element res (if we're talking about a min/max std build like u said). But now you're telling me, he needs more resistance on jewel? Even if he's using voidheart, He still has 4 rare items, which means 180 all element resistance.

Ok, I dont mind to loose the "min/max build criterion", let's say 35 all res in each rare items instead of 45. Thats supposed to be 175 all res with 5 rare items. 140 all res with 4 rare items. So ya, you only need 30 more all element res on jewel to cap at 170 (170 is OP's criterion I remember.) with voidheart setup. So thats only 3 suffixes of jewel. (I said 4 suffixes just bcz I let OP stands in a better condition to defend, even though I know he couldnt find any arugement to defend with his well skill.)

oh Watever, I'll loose even more min/max build criterion here to satisfy you. Let's assume you were right that OP needs Life/phys axe/area dmg/all res in each of his 6 jewels, and also assume OP is a poor guy who is only able to achieve 25 all res in each of his 4 rare items. So, in this condition, OP has alrdy 25*4+60=160 all res, he only need to drop 2 area dmg mods on jewel to achieve 170 all res goal and then he could use voidheart.

So its more clear now, and Yes, I can make back the loss even with the trash condition (25 all res on each rare items.)

"

gump124 wrote:

If a build has the EXACT same tree and gear, minus axe + ring, then ahfack's axe wins out in the end simply because he gets that extra ring slot. Sure, the axe+voidheart will have slightly higher dmg, but I would always take that extra ring slot over dmg any day.

first of all, its not a "sllightly" higer dmg but a 30~40% more dmg. In addition, you can make back the loss of the rare ring as I explained above or previous posts. So, well, you made a bad defense.

You lost even more logic, why do you wanna make a limitation of exact same gear/tree? Let me just make a funny example as metaphor:

Today, you're outdoor, and the weather suddenly starts to rain. Wat will u do next? basically you let the rain wet you, and you do nothing but hope the rain will be over soon.
More specifically, today, the game meta has changed, and is proved new meta wins old one. But wat u do next? you do nothing, you keep your old gears, and hope the new meta will get nerfed soon.

It's hilarious for OP to want new meta fits his gear/build, but not make some change to fit new meta (OH, my bad, he cant make any change cause all he has is the bleeding axe).