[Feedback] RNG should leave (29.04.2016 UPDATE)

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Tsokushin wrote:

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Tin_Foil_Hat wrote:

Yeah, i glossed over your post because youre the lowest common denominator, a prime example of what kind of shitty expectations new players have when they join during free loot leagues like Perandus League.

Youre in for a rude awakening if you expect the game to be that easy after the league is done and over with.

Edit - Oh and i glossed over most of that post too but i find it funny youre trying to talk about crafting yet have no idea how or what meta mods are and how they trivialize the crafting system.

Thanks GGG, these are the types of players you bring in with free loot leagues.

Edit 2 - And you seem to be under the impression crafting should be the end all be all and it already casualized the game enough to the point where you can throw a single mod on an item and it will be "good enough" til you find something better.

Game is E Z.

Lowest common denominator? A new player willing to support the game? I wouldn't allow you to run a business, that's for sure.

In any case, if more hard grassed RNG is what I can expect, then I guess I've spent all I'm willing to spend.

In any case, Meta Crafting Mods do not give top tier stats, in addition they cost exalted orbs to put them on any item. Exalted orbs do not drop everyday. The only worthwhile way to acquire a mass of them is, as I've said, using poe.trade which inevitably leads to me spending more damn time alt tabbed trying to trade my way up rather than playing the actual game. But oh wait, doesn't even matter because even with crafting there's still a layer of RNG to it, at least when it comes to coloring sockets to your personal specification.

And, I'd prefer that the game difficulty be gated behind actual mechanics, not RNG. What you're saying is akin to playing Roulette and winning and saying it's easy. You didn't win by skill, nor effort within the actual game. You won because you were lucky.

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Perq wrote:

RNG is ok, but it helps if you use entropy systems, so you don't screw people on wrong side of Gaussian curve - just like in the case of Evasion. Crafting with fuses/jewelers happens to be the best example. :V

But yeah, other than that, this is what makes PoE replayable. You can't expect to get certain stuff if you do X. Its RNG, and this is why most of us is still playing it. Unexpected can happen.

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Tin_Foil_Hat wrote:

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Perq wrote:

RNG is ok, but it helps if you use entropy systems, so you don't screw people on wrong side of Gaussian curve - just like in the case of Evasion. Crafting with fuses/jewelers happens to be the best example. :V

But yeah, other than that, this is what makes PoE replayable. You can't expect to get certain stuff if you do X. Its RNG, and this is why most of us is still playing it. Unexpected can happen.

Yeah, apparently people dont understand crafting is that "entropy" though.

Back in the day you find an item that lacks x/y/z stat, you didnt go, "Oh hey, i can use this i just need to master craft a mod on it and i can use it!".

Back in the day you find an item and its either good or vendor, there was no "good enough, i can just craft what i need onto it".

Master crafting was a reasonable balancing point for RNG when crafting even though it arguably made it too easy.

I dont get how someone can sit here and complain about a permanent meta mod costing a couple exalts that allows you to scour exalt for T1 mods, after locking 3 T1 mods. In cases with weapons you quite literally only need to hit 3 T1 mods (Ideally %, % hybird, flat).

Back in the day you had to do Alt+Aug+Regal, then you had to Eternal (which were 3-5ex each depending on when you played, and they went up when it was announce theyd be removed). Each failed exalt meant using the imprint, then using another eternal. Effectively old crafting was exponentially more expensive.

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Tin_Foil_Hat wrote:

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Tsokushin wrote:

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Tin_Foil_Hat wrote:

Yeah, i glossed over your post because youre the lowest common denominator, a prime example of what kind of shitty expectations new players have when they join during free loot leagues like Perandus League.

Youre in for a rude awakening if you expect the game to be that easy after the league is done and over with.

Edit - Oh and i glossed over most of that post too but i find it funny youre trying to talk about crafting yet have no idea how or what meta mods are and how they trivialize the crafting system.

Thanks GGG, these are the types of players you bring in with free loot leagues.

Edit 2 - And you seem to be under the impression crafting should be the end all be all and it already casualized the game enough to the point where you can throw a single mod on an item and it will be "good enough" til you find something better.

Game is E Z.

Lowest common denominator? A new player willing to support the game? I wouldn't allow you to run a business, that's for sure.

In any case, if more hard grassed RNG is what I can expect, then I guess I've spent all I'm willing to spend.

In any case, Meta Crafting Mods do not give top tier stats, in addition they cost exalted orbs to put them on any item. Exalted orbs do not drop everyday. The only worthwhile way to acquire a mass of them is, as I've said, using poe.trade which inevitably leads to me spending more damn time alt tabbed trying to trade my way up rather than playing the actual game. But oh wait, doesn't even matter because even with crafting there's still a layer of RNG to it, at least when it comes to coloring sockets to your personal specification.

And, I'd prefer that the game difficulty be gated behind actual mechanics, not RNG. What you're saying is akin to playing Roulette and winning and saying it's easy. You didn't win by skill, nor effort within the actual game. You won because you were lucky.

Dear god the lack of understanding from you, you clearly have no idea what im even talking about.

Thanks GGG, this is what your game is becoming. People who dont even remotely understand the game trying to argue about things they literally do not understand.

10/10

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Tsokushin wrote:

As a new player, with a fully public profile, and who has paid into the game because I liked the gameplay mechanics when I started, the RNG needs to be toned WAY down.

It's starting to get ridiculous when I'm attempting to see what all the endgame has to offer only to be shut down because RNG didn't give me a necessary 6l in all the fuses I've used. Worse yet, it's asking for an exorbitant 1500 fuses to actually make one, one which would take literal ages to farm yourself. This doesn't even take into account that for the best of my current build, I'd need a solid 4-5 blue sockets, which for some reason it's been decided that str armor should lower the chance of it being applied. Even using the Vorici 2 or 3b for the past 60 times (resulting in over 2k loss in chroms to date) has been nothing but arduous.

To make matters worse, because I was investing my currency into trying to get a 6 linked, 4-5 blue sockets strength based armor, I'm now on the verge of being broke, so now I cannot even buy much anything. This means that all the currency I acquired towards this end has resulted in absolutely nothing. Right now, it's not the actual difficulty of the t14-15 bosses themselves that stop me, but rather RNG because it prevents me from progressing.

Then there's the actual trading. I'm still new and I have no idea what anything is truly worth, but for one thing, Trade chat is full of people trying to charge you an arm and a leg compared to what you'd find on poe.trade. Now, when I log in, I'm spending a good portion of my damn time tabbed out of the game trying to price my stuff to sell instead of actually playing the game. This is stupid.

All of you people pandering to RNG have never worked with your hands in real life. Have never dug holes, built anything, honest work. There is no RNG to any of that. It's all careful, planned, all the difficulty is in the execution, and it's all equally rewarding compared to the work put in. Honest work. Where the reward is in direct comparison to the amount of work or skill you had to display.

And before you state "why don't you put work into trading" I mean work actually playing just the damn game, going out, fighting stuff, exploring maps, etc.

I'm not saying RNG on combat mechanics needs to be removed, that's at least understandable. But RNG when it comes to crafting and drops needs to be adequately addressed. If I kill one of the most difficult t14-15 map bosses, I should have something to show for it. If I have a reasonable amount of Chromatic Orbs, then I should be able to color it successfully the way I need it.

This game is damn well hard enough with the fact that some builds (close range) are just doomed to fail or have it harder mechanically than other builds without having to fight RNG itself so that I'm able to perform.

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TreeOfDead wrote:

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Tsokushin wrote:

As a new player, with a fully public profile, and who has paid into the game because I liked the gameplay mechanics when I started, the RNG needs to be toned WAY down.

It's starting to get ridiculous when I'm attempting to see what all the endgame has to offer only to be shut down because RNG didn't give me a necessary 6l in all the fuses I've used. Worse yet, it's asking for an exorbitant 1500 fuses to actually make one, one which would take literal ages to farm yourself. This doesn't even take into account that for the best of my current build, I'd need a solid 4-5 blue sockets, which for some reason it's been decided that str armor should lower the chance of it being applied. Even using the Vorici 2 or 3b for the past 60 times (resulting in over 2k loss in chroms to date) has been nothing but arduous.

To make matters worse, because I was investing my currency into trying to get a 6 linked, 4-5 blue sockets strength based armor, I'm now on the verge of being broke, so now I cannot even buy much anything. This means that all the currency I acquired towards this end has resulted in absolutely nothing. Right now, it's not the actual difficulty of the t14-15 bosses themselves that stop me, but rather RNG because it prevents me from progressing.

Then there's the actual trading. I'm still new and I have no idea what anything is truly worth, but for one thing, Trade chat is full of people trying to charge you an arm and a leg compared to what you'd find on poe.trade. Now, when I log in, I'm spending a good portion of my damn time tabbed out of the game trying to price my stuff to sell instead of actually playing the game. This is stupid.

All of you people pandering to RNG have never worked with your hands in real life. Have never dug holes, built anything, honest work. There is no RNG to any of that. It's all careful, planned, all the difficulty is in the execution, and it's all equally rewarding compared to the work put in. Honest work. Where the reward is in direct comparison to the amount of work or skill you had to display.

And before you state "why don't you put work into trading" I mean work actually playing just the damn game, going out, fighting stuff, exploring maps, etc.

I'm not saying RNG on combat mechanics needs to be removed, that's at least understandable. But RNG when it comes to crafting and drops needs to be adequately addressed. If I kill one of the most difficult t14-15 map bosses, I should have something to show for it. If I have a reasonable amount of Chromatic Orbs, then I should be able to color it successfully the way I need it.

This game is damn well hard enough with the fact that some builds (close range) are just doomed to fail or have it harder mechanically than other builds without having to fight RNG itself so that I'm able to perform.

Well said! But don't think that brainwashed rng lovers would understand anything from your or mine post, they blind and so busy with SWJ stuff in every thread and every forum.

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Tsokushin wrote:

Look, I didn't read the entire thread so I have no idea where or why people are bringing up this entire Social Justice thing here. All I'm talking about is how RNG is detrimental to the longevity of this game.

I honestly don't see why they could shift the focus of difficulty from RNG in loot drops to actually having difficult boss fights and such. It gets to be annoying when you're not playing a faceroll, 1 shot boss build and actually need the upgrades to be able to do the content.

Reducing a lot of the RNG and giving people tools to more vastly explore builds would actually lend more longevity to this game, especially completionists that like to try to defeat every boss there is in the game and reach 100 before progressing with a new character.

But, in the end, as Chris said, the start of Perandus League and the advent of wider item availability lead to a new peak in player count along with longer player retention.