Slayer - Impact
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last character just died and I'm working on a new idea
but I really would like to know the details of the mechanics of the Slayers Impact passive all it says it: Single-target melee attacks deal splash damage to surrounding targets 50% less damage to surrounding targets 15% increased radius of area skills that's fine in that it gives a general idea of what the node does but I have so many questions, all I have been able to find is this quote from Mark: "Melee attacks splashing is a boolean property. Having two things (the passive and the gem) affecting an attack to make it splash is no different to just one of them - it splashes. The damage modifier is a separate damage modifier to splash damage, if both are in play, both damage modifiers apply. In general, if you have the node, you probably don't want the gem." this answers some questions, but all in a roundabout way. So I thought I'd post here and hope for some clarification. 1. What is the exact radius this gives to melee attacks... from the statement above I'm assuming it gives the same radius as a lvl 1 melee splash gem, which I'm having a hard time finding exacts on that as well but I've used the gem before and atleast have some idea of what that is 2. given that this makes melee attacks have an area does the increased area of effect gem now work when linked with single target skill gems? - this is a little more confusing, because nothing specifies giving attacks the aoe keyword, could we get clarification that with this passive increased aoe gems will work for all single target attacks? 3. just to be sure, does this skill affect in any way the damage of skills that already have the aoe keyword? for example it will not make ground slam deal 50% less damage or anything like that correct? 4. from the statement from mark: "In general, if you have the node, you probably don't want the gem.", I have to disagree with this if it works as it appears. the gem has 2 MAJOR benefits that this passive does not have... the most significant is the lesser damage multiplier on splash targets... this passive is a flat 50% less to all other targets, the gem goes all the way down to around 30% less to splash targets, that's a large damage increase for using the gem. secondly the gem provides a MORE multiplier to area as it levels up to 20% more (even more with quality), this to me is a much less significant complaint since the impact node comes with 15% increased radius, this is an 15% increase, not a 20% multiplier, but it's still nice. I list the lesser area because it means the passive falls short in both ways, basically giving 20% LESS (multiplier) damage to all aoe targets, and having a slightly smaller area to hit things in also... I really think the nodes intent is awesome, but placement or the details of the node itself need tweaking to make really useful. my personal take is that since all the ascendancy tree's seem to be aimed at a particular build getting everything related to it's build in the 6 points expended, the simplest solution would be to change the Impacts passive -50% to all splash targets, into -40% to all splash targets, making it comparable to a lvl 11 melee splash ( or even 36% - equiv of lvl 15), and thereby making the argument over using the gem less clear, since most melee builds will have a standard 4 link core of: chosen skill> melee splash> multistrike (faster)> melee physical, with the 5th gem usually being added fire... and the 6th as weapon elemental depending on build(possibly reversed 5 and 6 depending on skill) they are not significantly tight on gem slots to argue not having to use the melee splash gem is enough benefit in itself Last edited by Makari2180 on Mar 27, 2016, 7:39:41 PM Last bumped on Jan 16, 2017, 5:10:16 PM
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"The base radius of splashing melee attacks is 14 units. "No. This isn't a support, it can't change what supports a skill will work with. "For the splash, yes, if those skills perform a single-target melee attack. It will only affect that part of the skill, by adding splash damage with the specified multiplier. So it would affect things like Molten Strike or Wild Strike on the melee hit, but will not affect Ground Slam, since that doesn't perform a single-target melee strike. The increased area modifier on the passive will of course affect any skill that is affected by area modifiers. "That's only true if you compare using only the gem to using only the passive, which is not what I was talking about in the quoted text. I said that "if you have the node, you probably don't want the gem", which is saying that having only the passive will mostly be better than having both the passive and the gem, because, as mentioned in the other bit you quoted, "The damage modifier is a separate damage modifier to splash damage, if both are in play, both damage modifiers apply." If you have the passive, you already have the splash property, and a 50% less splash damage modifier. Adding the gem to that doesn't add the splash property (because you already have it), but does add another less damage modifier to the splash damage. While you're correct that you can gain some area from this, the substantial penalty of getting a second less modifier on the splash damage will in most cases make this combination not worth it. I stand by my statement. | |
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Thank you for the reply, and clarifications
I see what you're saying about your statement being IF YOU HAVE THE NODE I'm struggling to think of a situation where the node would be superior or atleast a viable alternative to just using the Gem though, since as I state before, I'm usually not strapped for sockets, especially once i get a 5L |
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" 70% compared with 50% is the same as a "40% more" multiplier gem for surrounding targets. So unless you have a 40% more gem you can add, I'd say go for the melee splash gem. I think the main point of the node is to give your single target attacks (that you use for killing single targets) some way of still dealing with trash mobs while you focus down the rare or unique enemy. Face it, all of your suggestions are worse than this idea:
http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/657756 |
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one other thing to mention: if you get a support gem with 40% more damage that compensates the damage on splash, you will end up with 40% more damage single target
IGN: Eric_Lindros CET: Timezone Last edited by Ludvator on Mar 29, 2016, 3:44:33 PM
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Just to make sure I'm getting things right here.
- Impact can't be supported by the Inc. AoE support gem? - Impact damage reduction stacks with Melee Splash support gem thus using both to get both the increased area from the support gems and the passive area from Impact sucks? Given that my biggest "issue" with Melee Splash the lack of AoE when compared to other skills with innate AoE. Thus I'm currently playing with Viper Strike, Melee Splash, Inc. AoE, Melee Physical and Multistrike and I'm pretty happy with the area it has, I was just hoping to "abuse" the impact passive to get rid of the Melee Splash gem. |
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1. Only if the Skill itself can be Supported (Wild Strike, for example).
2. You'd get both Less Damage penalties, yes. | |
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is impact aoe radius affected by the increased aoe % modifiers on other skill tree nodes? such as the slayer ones and the ones by templar? or does the aoe radius stay fixed at 14?
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" Like Vipermagi said, if the skill can be supported by AoE supports (eg: Wild Strike, Vigilant Strike, infernal blow) then impact will get a boost to its AoE from tree nodes too. If it can't be (eg: frenzy, elemental hit, viper strike) then it will stay at 14. Face it, all of your suggestions are worse than this idea:
http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/657756 |
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Impact will always get a boost from Radius modifiers - Impact will only benefit from the Radius Support if the Skill can be supported by default. :)
Actually, could also link Elemental Proliferation to get Inc Radius to link up to any Skill. Point is, if the Radius Support cannot link up to a Skill, speccing Impact will not change that fact. Last edited by Vipermagi on Jun 22, 2016, 5:40:50 AM
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