SET FREE THE ASCENDANCY POINTS (or rework the lab) [New ascension methods/lab rework ideas]

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wweeep wrote:

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Sound harash, but there is some truth in this post. GGG changed over the last year(s). The only thing I don't agree with is that it isn't right for them to deliver the new QfL Stashtabs. You're right: They could have implemented this in the premium stash tabs. But lets be honest here: Stashtabs are a one-time purchase. You pay your 20$ once (maybe even less if it's a deal) and then you will probably n ever again pay something. At least I guess that's how it is for the most players. Lets not forget that when we talk about World of Warcraft, the player has to pay:

- The Game
- The Add-Ons
- the monthly fee (only allowing you to play the game)

The first year WoW will cost you like 150$+, probably even 200$+. And that's just one year. After that, you will keep paying your 12$ per month or you can pay more and instantly get a max-level character. WoW does cost a lot of money and they player doesn't get much in return for that money.

If you want to play PoE, you have to pay:

- nothing

The game is free to download and there are no Add-Ons you need to buy. There's also no monthly fee. Now lets compare the income of a WoW and a PoE player:

WoW Player: 150$+ after 1year
PoE Player: 0$ for one year

So GGG needs to search for way to at least motivate the player to pay for something at least once in a year. (Premium) Stash Tabs are a very good way to make money, but most are satisfied with 3 bundles. After that, the player will probably play the game many years without paying anything. Thanks to the currency stash tab, people tend to buy this tab for 7.50$. And lets not forget: You still can place your currency in the normal tabs. No one forces you to buy it.

I just wanted to post this because I dont think GGG is really trying to rip off the player. It's still a game that is meant to make some kind of profit and why shouldn't they make (alot) of money when they deliver a good game?

But especially that last part is important: Is PoE still a good game? I think right now it is still Ok. I still have fun and since I don't like the lab, I pay for the runs. But like you said: A game shouldn't motivate the player to pay for rushs. A game should motivate the player to do the things on their own. PoE is all about hardcore gaming experience and if you can just pay someone to do the bosses or the lab for you, then the game fails to create an anjoying atmosphere. For example: I think the player has to be in the actual boss room to get the kill. He doesn't need to do the damage, but at least he needs to be present and needs to tackle the risk of dying. And the same goes for the lab. But don't get me wrong: I still think the lab, as it is right now, is an insult for many players who like the classic way of PoE and don't want the gauntlet gameplay. It is forced upon you because of the AC points and there's no real reason why GGG made that decision. Yes, traps are a nice idea, but in practical terms, it is not fair to actually force the players to do it. Some don't like the gauntlet-gameplay, some just have a bad connection and others just find it boring compared to classic gameplay. And no, saying you can play without the AC points is no valid argument, since in PoE, it's all about customization of your character and the AC points have a heavy influence on your builds effectiveness.

So all in all I can understand that GGG tries to find ways to make money in the future and I can still enjoy the game. But the direction of where the game is going worries me a little bit and I really fear the PoE becomes something which I can't enjoy anymore in the future, especially since I play it so long now and supported it several times as good as I can.

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Rayzabladez wrote:

What I am however, is a business man and a game player.

A mature businessman with a very long career in business and in the computer and gaming industry.

What I wrote is fact.

What you wrote is speculation as you have no data to support your claims. Keep in mind I specifically said "only reason" as I'm sure players have left because of the lab, however, it is pure idiocy to imply that every player that left has only the lab for a reason. I myself am not playing/supporting and it has nothing to do with the lab so even if I am a unique case I make your "fact" a complete fiction.

I do not disagree with the competitive aspect of online gaming and said nothing about it; your reading must not be on par with your business acumen.

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wweeep wrote:

So there's no point to argue if the game is dead or is gonna die. It's probably alive in some sense, maybe even bigger than it was before. But the apologists would never understand what died in the way, what we lost in the way, and what we mean when we say GGG is taking this game in a shameful direction.

+1 to a lot of what you said and especially this. "Shameful" direction really resonates with me; I hate what they've done consistently for 2-3 leagues now and it's more disgusting each league they do it.

I am not going to discuss specifics, but if you're mad about it then you know what I'm talking about (sorry lab haters but for me it has nothing to do with the lab though at this point I see hatred of the game direction as a common ground for us all).

dos, you have nfi about my business acumen, i'm afraid.. to say that i'm filthy rich would be a gross understatement. :)

However, i'll let that slide.

What I would like to say is that I agree with you and weeep about the direction this game is taking.

Not just because of the lab thing, but overall.

I believe that weeep's post is right on target.

This game has gone off the rails ...

That's true. There is virtually no competition in the ARPG market. PoE is the only successor of D2, and it's pretty bad at it. D2 was so much more immersive, cohesive, and all around solid than this.

I HOPE, HOPE, that Lineage eternal or lost ark come soon and don't completely suck like they probably will because they're korean made.

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laycast wrote:

That's true. There is virtually no competition in the ARPG market. PoE is the only successor of D2, and it's pretty bad at it. D2 was so much more immersive, cohesive, and all around solid than this.

I HOPE, HOPE, that Lineage eternal or lost ark come soon and don't completely suck like they probably will because they're korean made.

Your view is tainted at best, D2 does not hold up that well this day and age without serious modification, even then using outdated stuff like pots for healing or mana instead of flask is just one example of a system that PoE is Superior in.

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Rayzabladez wrote:

This game has gone off the rails ...

+1.

Could not have said it any better.

I do think it could be salvaged but, at this time, I do not harbor any serious hope that it will be salvaged.

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Dos_Fafner wrote:

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Rayzabladez wrote:

This game has gone off the rails ...

+1.

Could not have said it any better.

I do think it could be salvaged but, at this time, I do not harbor any serious hope that it will be salvaged.

Technically this game went off the rails when it went on the rails :)

Hopefully they fix this next season and make this game fun again, right now its not fun.

GGG needs to wake up and realize how big a failure the lab is and take a mulligan but no they decided we are a vocal minority and shove it down our throats with uber lab. No thx GGG. Was the last straw for me. I dont like where POE is going and what POE has become. Im retired awaiting a fix to lab and other issues that now plague POE like xp in maps and continued lag.

-Icanthazmoarminions. 92 Necro. Retired.

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Prebornfetus wrote:

GGG needs to wake up and realize how big a failure the lab is and take a mulligan but no they decided we are a vocal minority and shove it down our throats with uber lab. No thx GGG. Was the last straw for me. I dont like where POE is going and what POE has become. Im retired awaiting a fix to lab and other issues that now plague POE like xp in maps and continued lag.

-Icanthazmoarminions. 92 Necro. Retired.

Its really sad actually that this fucking thing causes people to leave while a simple (while might not the optimal) solution is out there.

While in another thread about a player quiting the game cause he died in trials i came to realise how much the same people saying they hate the lab and how boring/tedious they find it, are the same people that with their action actually keep/kept the lab where it is in GGG's eyes.

Stating that you hate/dislike/despice the content and then proceed to swallowing your pride and doing it cause "reasons" (it really doesnt matter what the reasoning here is) only reinforces GGG's foolish belief that the lab is in an ok state. IT IS NOT, and YOU are one of the reasons that it stays the same. STOP PLAYING THE LAB if you find it tedious and unfun, boring and alienating, if you dont agree with the gameplay or you are sick and tired starting all over again when you dc, if you disagree with the ascendancies being gated behind it or whatever other reason. Seriously if you are happy with it keep running it, if not then DONT YOU EVER STEP IN IT. Its that simple.

-"But the ascendancies are so powerful and i build my whole character around having one, and they allow me to enjoy more the rest of the game, and i just run it once per difficulty for the points only etc."

If you want the labyrinth to change and improve, then STOP BEING A BITCH and REFUSE TO DO WHAT YOU DISLIKE because the reward is so enticing and overpowered. No matter the reason you are doing it, the outcome is YOU giving GGG false data about lab's player retention. Extreme measures must be taken against extreme bullshit being forced to the game and the players.

Prophecy HC is dead, amongst many others, lab is a major reason for that (proof in the numbers of the leagues, as well as many "HC" players openly stating they went SC cause of that). Do you know what is the most often used message in the trade chat in ProHC? WTB lab run/carry (merci/endgame/cruel/normal thats the order from most to least asked). People are doing everything they can to have a less tedious experience with it. And while i understand them, i cant but charge them as being guilty of helping the whole issue, because in the end they yield without taking a stand to fight the problem. They give a false message to GGG that 99% of the playerbase wants to do the labyrinth.

Leaving/quitting or stop supporting GGG surely passes a certain message, but that message is not always clear. Refusing to do the content they are forcing down our throats is giving them the true data about it and thats a very effective way to show them how much of a "minority" people hating on the content are.

MAN THE FUCK UP AND STOP DOING THE THING YOU CLAIM YOU DISLIKE.

SET THE ASCENDANCY POINTS FREE AND IMPROVE THE LABYRINTH. #MakePoEFunAgain #labsucksonchode #PoEisARPGnotPlatformer