Some food for thought.

First of all, i would like to ask our dear moderators not to move this to feedback. Even though it will include alot of that too, it's more important to discuss what is causing people to abandon PoE early on then actually providing the feedback.

So yes, i am gonna quit PoE for a while. Since i have been a regular poster on the forum, mostly telling other people what they could do instead of complaining, i would like to enlighten why i am quitting. Because i think it will maybe shed some light on what is going wrong in PoE atm. I have played alot, i have alot of currency, and i've done all the content in the game in this league. I've build up a map pool from scratch up to a bunch of 82's. Have several 85+ characters, with 1 even being 96. I have played atleast 10 different builds this league. I know, i have been playing to much. However this is not a burnout story. I love this game, and will certainly be back whenever the next league starts.

Let's start at the things that i think were done wrong in 2.0.

Mapping 2.0.

As some of you may know i often comment in map threads that people need to try harder to build up their map pool, and that building up a map pool is not the biggest issue right now. I still firmly believe in that statement. With the right approach everyone can build up their map pool towards 80+, lucky or unlucky it matters little.

This however does not mean i think mapping is, and then especially end-game mapping is in a good state.

The amount of sheer currency needed to fully supply an end game mapper to sustain his pool is absurd. And even then the rewards are very tiny, with low spikes towards non-existing. I made a simple calculation that the 25maps i needed yesterday to level to 96, including map costs are around 16ex. (Zana mods/chisels/sac frags etc) They returned not 1 single 79 map or higher. Now this is extremely unlucky, normally this investment would atleast return something, but it does make one wonder, if you run the craziest mods, pay chisels/frags and zana mod every map and STILL get no map continuity, there is something wrong.

There is something wrong because there is only a very very tiny part of the community that can even bare these costs mapping back to back solo. And then there are even fewer who actually do.

Monster Damage 2.0

So we got some changes to ensure everything is more scary etc. I think this change is awesome. Partly atleast. When i come up against monsters that do tremendous damage but can be countered by moving right or bosses that can be countered by playing well i feel like what i should feel when taking down something like that.

THere are however WAY to many unfair monster combo's in the game wich even if you run with the maximum amount of defences this game has to offer can instagib you and leave you disorientated. They make you feel helpless and it's not providing a good game experience.

What this damage also does is limit builds tremendously. Sure not every character has to reach 95+, but the traditional glasscannon has really seen it's time in PoE right now. And i enjoyed those builds. 80% of my time spent in WB was playing an incinerator. Now i love the new incinerate, but many will know why i played that skill on multiple characters.
Nobody like to die alot, the balance of monster damage should have been more of a priority after months of Beta. To ensure more build diversity.
I mean what's the difference between everyone running CoD (Wich was apparently a problem) to everyone running MoM/Fortify/Coil/End charge/taste of hate etc. You are just pushing people from all the awesome silly builds this game has to offer.


Map crashes 2.0.

Yes i am actually devoting a special section for this. This is probably reason nr1 why i want to move on from this league and wait for the next.

Anyone who is mapping back to back in 79+ maps with massive investments will recognize this. Your bags are full, you go out empty up. When you go back in you dc. And the map is lost.

This actually happened to frequently i am afraid to go out and empty my bags. I don't want to lose my 1ex map just to get a few alt shards. It's very very frustrating though. I understand fully bugs exist. But the amount of maps i lost because of this, and then in particular 79+ (The recent crash that happened to everyone costed me an 82 core for example) is just to much.

Warbands

Man i was so exited when they announced this. The possibilities seemed endless. But the very simple mistake of not being able track them properly and missing a good reward system from them (No map drops either) makes this league so lackluster. What's the point of having a wartbands league when you can't find the ones you want (or grind them!) and they don't drop additional stuff. (Except for some ultra rare uniques)

You know why Ambush was so popular and has remained kind of SC leagues for me and many others. The rewards were just amazing. Ok i admit, maybe cartho's were abit OP back in those days, but come on. Warbands adds ZERO exitement. Missed opportunity in my eyes. Still had faith you would fix this. Still the eyes of the balance team are more focused on nerfing then buffing.


Nerfing 2.0

So i am not gonna talk about skill nerfs or anything like that. I solely play leagues. So that's not relevant for me. But did you really had to nerf cartho's 3 times over AGAIN. I mean the state of these boxes are so poor right now you might aswell remove them.

And what exiles? Masters? Like i said before not even warbands are dropping maps for god sake. The only and sole drops endgame mappers are looking for are maps (Besides the few super duper uniques) Exitement when i see an exile now in a high map = zero. Hes like one of the blue mobs, not threathening whatsoever, and will drop crap anyway.

Masters used to drop maps. I haven't seen a single one drop in any master mission. (This might just be RNG)

And now the last nerf made to ghosts. The pretty much last thing left that was kinda exiting is made irrelevant.

It's pretty sad if you would realize if they would remove all of this stuff, i wouldn't even care anymore. Because they have all been nerfed so hard they have been made irrelevant to assist a player in achieving goals.



The game improved alot though. And i still think my supporter pack was worth it 10times over. I have no issue with drop rates and carrots. Divination cards are in a decent spot etc. I even enjoyed levelling every single time because of the adjustments made.

There are plenty of positive things about 2.0. But other things like mana leech changes (Wich kinda just push everyone into blood magic instead) just feel so lazy. After all those months we all waited we should have had less issues in general.

P.s Sorry for the long post.

good read.
sorry to see you leave.
glad you finally understand that, even if you're doing extremely well the game isn't necessarily "perfect".

"

johnKeys wrote:

good read.
sorry to see you leave.
glad you finally understand that, even if you're doing extremely well the game isn't necessarily "perfect".

I think anyone who thinks any game is perfect is slightly delusional :)

And Rip my request not to be moved!

Hi


Good points, Laughed at ''Still the eyes of the balance team are more focused on nerfing then buffing.'' SO TRUE.

Balance team doesn't comprehend how intricate the environment they made is and how everything mixes together, its like they never play the game and stare at sheets of data and not the subtle tricks that accompany some builds in the survival of Wraeclast.

Unluckiest player in warbands: ZERO EXALT DROPS, solo play and average of 4 hrs a day with some mf for once over 50%, WTF!>?!?! No wonder exalts cost so much, GGG probably shadow nerfed them, way to fuck with your highly vaunted economy.

Warbands sucks also because Players are getting tired of these half arsed leagues that don't get any real fixes until the end of the league, Chris even admits in the 187 boondoggle (seriously that was horrible it didn't go in depth into anything it skimmed the surface forever) that the flame totem will be adjusted after league is over. Thanks for admitting the truth of what so many thought for so many leagues now: GGG makes some skills the flavor of the league, THIS FAVORITISM has to stop it ruins the balance of the game.

What many players, including myself, would like to play is a polished league for once, a league that has been pre-tested and balanced BEFORE we play it NOT AFTERWARDS.

cheers

Read all your points and I agree with all of them . The issue is that it seems GGG is the anti-fun police focusing more on their ''ideal game'' instead of the ''ideal game the players want'' which is sad, since I doubt they even play their game as much. Look at CI. It requires massive investment to be on-par with CI/Hp/bm builds. Look at all the builds pilling up and never getting used because they cannot compete in efficiency with the usual incinerator/dual flame totem/etc cookie cutter ones. As crazy as it seems not everyone wants to play cookie cutter builds and GGG does not seem to understand that.

Warband league? don't even get me started. I completed all the challenges for it, but the ratio of chaos warbands is 1/100 maps that have 4 stars. The drop rate is pathetic and some people used to pay 20-30c for specific chaos bosses when ex was still 1:60c, that is how bad their appearance is. One other issue with those chaos guys? over tuned just like A4 creeps. I was in an instance with 2 other players going for Mogrants, I saw special effects covering my screen, freezing it for 10 seconds then noticing my summoner+all summons/animate guardian dead . Where is the particle effect on and off option? Those are just a few of the issues, along with many others

"

Miská wrote:

As some of you may know i often comment in map threads that people need to try harder to build up their map pool, and that building up a map pool is not the biggest issue right now. I still firmly believe in that statement. With the right approach everyone can build up their map pool towards 80+, lucky or unlucky it matters little.

Hmm. Interesting. Seeing that I have less experience with mapping 2.0 since I was just turned off by the map drop rates, here is a question though: Do you think that building a map pool towards 80+ is not only possible (I am sure it is), but sustainable (i.e. you can do it without farming for additional currency in other zones / lower maps) for a single player, without using more currency than you invest?

"

Char1983 wrote:

"

Miská wrote:

As some of you may know i often comment in map threads that people need to try harder to build up their map pool, and that building up a map pool is not the biggest issue right now. I still firmly believe in that statement. With the right approach everyone can build up their map pool towards 80+, lucky or unlucky it matters little.

Hmm. Interesting. Seeing that I have less experience with mapping 2.0 since I was just turned off by the map drop rates, here is a question though: Do you think that building a map pool towards 80+ is not only possible (I am sure it is), but sustainable (i.e. you can do it without farming for additional currency in other zones / lower maps) for a single player, without using more currency than you invest?

it is not

"

Char1983 wrote:

"

Miská wrote:

As some of you may know i often comment in map threads that people need to try harder to build up their map pool, and that building up a map pool is not the biggest issue right now. I still firmly believe in that statement. With the right approach everyone can build up their map pool towards 80+, lucky or unlucky it matters little.

Hmm. Interesting. Seeing that I have less experience with mapping 2.0 since I was just turned off by the map drop rates, here is a question though: Do you think that building a map pool towards 80+ is not only possible (I am sure it is), but sustainable (i.e. you can do it without farming for additional currency in other zones / lower maps) for a single player, without using more currency than you invest?

Well that is an interesting question. I don't think you can sustain 79+ as a solo player without adding currency. But then again that's not such a bad thing, since they don't want that pool to be sustainable in the first place. I do feel though when you invest as much as an ex per map you should see some returns.

Up to 78 it is doable though. You don't need to roll 150%q on each map. You only need to build a proper base. Wich is done by running 70-75's till your eyes bleed pretty much.

I mean, how much do you get on average from a map? 1 Chaos and 1 Fusing maybe, a Vaal or GCP if you are lucky. Let's say 1c on average for the SAC pieces from the corrupted boss. Lets say like 5c on average, plus maybe 3c of stuff you vendor or trade, 8 Chaos in total, on average.

You need to spend:

- 4 Chisels (about 1.3 Chaos)
- 1 Alchemy (no idea, maybe .3 Chaos? Doesn't really matter)
- A few Chaos to re-roll, let's say 3
- 3 SAC fragments (3+ Chaos)
- Vaal about maybe half the time (thats 0.7 Chaos)


So, that is about 8 Chaos per map, just sustainable, if you do some trading. If you do not do trading, you already have a problem. The question is: What kind of map level can you sustain without Zana mods?

"

Char1983 wrote:

The question is: What kind of map level can you sustain without Zana mods?

I've been running maps without Zana mods and was able to sustain 77.

Can't break that barrier though and vendoring 3 77 maps for 1 78 is not worth it.