Damage Conversion

My question is: Does the 'Added as' modifier always applies before the 'Converted to' modifier?

Example:

Avatar of Fire, Hatred (lvl 1), Cold to Fire (lvl 1), Glacial Hammer (lvl 1), 1000 Physical Damage Input

Side Note: I am aware that Glacial Hammer deals 130% of Base Damage and we'd therefor have 1300 Physical Damage as Input, but for the sake of simplicity I will just ignore it and take 1000 Physical Damage as Input.

Added as Modifiers
Hatred: 30% of Physical Damage added as extra Cold Damage
-> 1000 Physical Damage, 300 Cold Damage

Cold to Fire: 10% of Cold Damage added as extra Fire Damage
-> 1000 Physical Damage, 300 Cold Damage, 30 Fire Damage

Converted to Modifiers
AoF: 50% of Physical Damage converted to Fire Damage
-> 500 Physical Damage, 300 Cold Damage, 530 Fire Damage
Glacial Hamer: 50% of Physical Damage converted to Cold Damage (Since the Converted to Modifiers apply simulanously the remaining 50% will be converted)
-> 800 Cold Damage, 530 Fire Damage
Cold to Fire + AoF: 100% of Cold Damage converted to Fire Damage
-> 1330 Fire Damage

As you can see I applied the Added as Modifiers before the Converted to Modifiers. Is the math correct?

My next question would be: Which Modifiers from the passive tree would affect the damage? I know from the wiki that %increased physical damage and %increased fire damage would work. I'm pretty certain that %increased elemental damage would work aswell. But what about %increased cold damage?

"

kahzin wrote:

As you can see I applied the Added as Modifiers before the Converted to Modifiers. Is the math correct?

Well, adds and conversions to cold damage happen before those to fire, because cold has priority. Also, gem conversions have priority over item/passive conversions, so if you used ice crash, it would convert 60% of physical to fire and AoF would get 40%, instead of splitting the conversion 54%-46%.

So, you would add 30% cold to get 1300 and convert 50% physical to cold with glacial hammer, that would give you 800 cold and 500 physical. Then you add 10% cold as fire and convert the rest of physical to fire with AoF and all cold to fire with AoF and Cold to Fire gem.

"

kahzin wrote:

My next question would be: Which Modifiers from the passive tree would affect the damage? I know from the wiki that %increased physical damage and %increased fire damage would work. I'm pretty certain that %increased elemental damage would work aswell. But what about %increased cold damage?

You can think of it this way, physical damage bonus will affect any damage that was considered physical at any point in the process or derived from it, and that goes for other types as well. So, physical will affect all of your damage output because you only have physical base, everything else is derived from there. Cold will affect everything except that 50% physical leftover which was directly converted to fire, and fire will also affect everything because everything ended up as fire.

It doesnt work this way. I hope i get it right, if not, somebody will correct me.

At 1st u get + 300 cold dmg from hatred, than u get +30 fire dmg for cold to fire added dmg.

Now the conversion kicks in all at the same time.

Meaning u will end up with 500 cold dmg (phys dmg with glacial hammer) + 500 fire dmg (phys dmg with AoF) + 300 fire dmg (hatred converted with 50% AoF + 50% cold to fire) + 30 fire dmg form before.

So 500 cold + 830 fire dmg. AoF = 830 fire dmg as athe end result.

"

1337fun wrote:

It doesnt work this way. I hope i get it right, if not, somebody will correct me.

At 1st u get + 300 cold dmg from hatred, than u get +30 fire dmg for cold to fire added dmg.

Now the conversion kicks in all at the same time.

Meaning u will end up with 500 cold dmg (phys dmg with glacial hammer) + 500 fire dmg (phys dmg with AoF) + 300 fire dmg (hatred converted with 50% AoF + 50% cold to fire) + 30 fire dmg form before.

So 500 cold + 830 fire dmg. AoF = 830 fire dmg as athe end result.

This doesn't seem to be right. It's basically my calculation with the difference that you only converted 50% of the cold damage to fire damage. If you now consider the 50% cold damage converted to fire damage from AoF + 50% cold damage converted to fire damage from cold to fire you will have 100% conversion (as you said, it all kicks in at the same time) so you will end up dealing 1330 Fire damage.


@raics
So the order is:

Added as Cold Damage applies before Converted to Cold Damage applies before Added as Fire Damage applies before Converted to Fire Damage

Ah i forgot about conversion order phys -> lighting -> cold -> fire -> chaos. So yes, u r right u will end up with 1330 fire dmg. U just wrote or conversion sequence not good and it confused me a bit.

Right would be after 1000 phys + 300 cold + 30 fire:

Glacial hammer: 800 cold + 500 phys + 30 fire.
AoF + cold to fire: 100% cold dmg to fire + 50% of phys dmg to fire (500 is 50%) = 1330 fire.

"

kahzin wrote:

@raics
So the order is:

Added as Cold Damage applies before Converted to Cold Damage applies before Added as Fire Damage applies before Converted to Fire Damage

You basically need to fully resolve cold before moving on to fire.

1000 physical
1000 physical + 300 cold (hatred)
500 physical + 800 cold (glacial hammer)
500 physical + 800 cold + 80 fire (added fire)
1380 fire (AoF and added fire conversion)

"

raics wrote:

"

kahzin wrote:

@raics
So the order is:

Added as Cold Damage applies before Converted to Cold Damage applies before Added as Fire Damage applies before Converted to Fire Damage

You basically need to fully resolve cold before moving on to fire.

1000 physical
1000 physical + 300 cold (hatred)
500 physical + 800 cold (glacial hammer)
500 physical + 800 cold + 80 fire (added fire)
1380 fire (AoF and added fire)

So u mean, not only conversion but also extra added dmg also follows the same priority rule at the same time? Always thought it was dealt with before conversion.

Well, it's easy enough to test, link glacial hammer with added fire and you can see it gains some fire damage in addition to converting, it would gain nothing otherwise.

Let me get this straight. The right order would basically be:

Physical
x% of Physical Damage added as x Damage
x% of Physical Damage converted to x Damage

Lightning
x% of Lightning Damage added as x Damage
x% of Lightning Damage converted to x Damage

Cold
x% of Cold Damage added as x Damage
x% of Cold Damage converted to x Damage

Fire
x% of Fire Damage added as x Damage
x% of Fire Damage converted to x Damage

Chaos
x% of Chaos Damage added as x Damage
x% of Chaos Damage converted to x Damage

Furthermore modifiers from the passive tree (like %increased cold damage) will apply to the specific faction of the output damage that has (at some point) been cold damage (even if it was then converted to another damage type).

"

raics wrote:

Well, it's easy enough to test, link glacial hammer with added fire and you can see it gains some fire damage in addition to converting, it would gain nothing otherwise.

Exactly that is the reason, i am thinking, what i do. Added fire adds % fire dmg from 100% phys dmg before conversions. So i think 1st added dmg does it's round and when its done, conversion kicks in. Thats why 30 fire dmg and not 80 added form cold to fire.

EDIT

"

kahzin wrote:

Let me get this straight. The right order would basically be:

Physical
x% of Physical Damage added as x Damage
x% of Physical Damage converted to x Damage

Lightning
x% of Lightning Damage added as x Damage
x% of Lightning Damage converted to x Damage

Cold
x% of Cold Damage added as x Damage
x% of Cold Damage converted to x Damage

Fire
x% of Fire Damage added as x Damage
x% of Fire Damage converted to x Damage

Chaos
x% of Chaos Damage added as x Damage
x% of Chaos Damage converted to x Damage

Furthermore modifiers from the passive tree (like %increased cold damage) will apply to the specific faction of the output damage that has (at some point) been cold damage (even if it was then converted to another damage type).

Ok that makes sence, if u meant this raics