A potential change I'm keen to hear your thoughts on

It's certainly an interesting mechanic, but I worry about how this will affect Mind over Matter, getting both the regen, and a pool large enough to use it effectively could be cost prohibitive now.

Additionally the mechanics of using energy shield as payment under this system are atrocious, mana is made to be spent, but unless a character takes reduced ES cool down you're looking at spending 6 seconds without casting before your ES buffer replenishes. Even with the nearby reduction nodes you're still looking at more than 3 seconds of silence.

Unless you're taking either GR or ZO, both of which are direct reductions to your survivability with EB you're simply better off stacking increased mana nodes. Unless we can somehow get sufficient ES on hit you're looking a direct downgrade to simply running clarity.
I believe people will start using the mana pool for purely auras and then use MOM for the mitigation, this leads to mana leech becoming almost useless with this keystone unfortunately.

I suggest adding a "mana leech applies to energy shield" noteable on the skilltree. Maybe gated behind EB?
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Rory wrote:
Damage won't interrupt ES recovery any more, only losing mana or ES will.


This part could use clarification. If you take (non-chaos) damage you lose ES, so wouldn't that still stop ES recovery? If it doesn't, it seems like a massive buff to low life builds, they can cast via blood magic and just have their ES constantly regenerate for free.
Looks to me like it's complexity for the sake of complexity. Don't ruin your game trying to keep us off balance.
I recently made a KB build that utilizes both LC and MoM by getting a high rolled hybrid Eva/ES shield and taking some "%increased Defences from equipped Shield" nodes. I managed to get 2.4K Mana and got around 1.2K unreserved. Running 3 Heralds. Got enough damage to run 77/78 maps, I can even run dual reflect 74-75 maps, I killed Abaxoth on a hasted 74 map with this build.

And I was enjoying this very much until I saw this post. The fact that I won't be able to do this build or improve upon it because you thought changing EB completely was the only and correct way nerf to CoD/MoM/AA is kinda "disheartening" at best.

Gear





Well, might aswell just enjoy it while it lasts, right?
Nothing is more common than unsuccessful men with talent.
Glad you asked.

To be honest with you (and after sitting here for 15mins, not able to come up with a single good use for this): Dear god no.

Managing three resource pools (life, ES, mana) is already difficult for current hybrid chars, but at least you go the extra mile for some extra EHP, potentially helping you in burst situations.
This version of EB shares the same problems as a hybrid char has, that is efficient ways to sustain your three resources, just for some extra EMP (effective mana pool). But for what, except with MoM there are currently no situations where I'd need a mana pool that can catch a burst (that is also why everybody just reserves 90%+ of their mana). Even worse, your ES won't ever refill, since you'll never be able to do something in combat without interrupting its recharge.

The only remotely usefull build I can see does something I personally already have seen enough of: Use as much mana reserving buffs as you possibly can squeeze in. Skills can then be cast from ES (if there is some way to sustain it), but this won't net more than one extra aura.

On a side note, to me the design is a lot less elegant (read: unnecessary complex) than the current version. :\
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Weed wrote:
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Chundadragon wrote:
I'm finding this interesting - this completely trashes Cloak of Defiance :D

On the other hand, it needed to go - 8k EHP and god DPS for zero investment? :/


Zero investment = 5-6 (unlinked) exalt item... yeah zero investment! So EzPZ.


Compared to other ways of getting 8k EHP?
IGN: Chundaziri
8/8 Ambush/Invasion Complete - 21/06/2014
8/8 Warbands/Tempest Complete - 10/08/2015
Just make EB take only half ES as mana or something, much easier and simpler way to do what you are wanting to do.
All this would do is slow casters down, it slows the whole pacing of self casting and the insane costs of some spells would never be sutainable anymore

I understand wanting a nerf/tweak to aa/mom, but this just makes eb useless because having to wait for you es to recharge, means having to stop fight, means slowing the whole offensive down to a crawl, and if you have to defend yourself you are now f***ed because you cant anymore

One great thing about eb besides aa/mom was that it allowed to sustain high level spells which can easily use up several 100 mana per second

A more reaonable nerf, give eb some kind of "less es" modifer or reduced mana regen multiplier, not an additional layer of mana that never recharges unless you stop playing
Last edited by LadyAlekto on Apr 17, 2015, 9:31:08 PM
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I don't like it. It turns your ES into mana, and that is all I want to see. Also, does this imply that ES will be spent before mana. This means that ES regen will be separate from mana regen when using EB. As such, it'll be harder to get a very large mana regen by making use of EB.




ya Im with you man.


Can I ask waht the thought process is behind this? Is this change for the sake of change or is the idea to completely destroy life based spell casters and wipe them from viability? Because thats what this is from what I can see.

I hope its not from thoughts like this...

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Serleth wrote:

I think this change to EB falls back into that line. The EB/AA/CoD setup was easily the strongest defensive choice you could make, without really sacrificing a whole lot to get it done.


EB/COD/AA was one of the most investment intensive and weak defenses in the game. Compared to properly specced evasion, armour, ondars, endurance, acrobatics, lightning coil etc combos it is so terrible, absolutely terrible at mitigating damage. Thats good, because if it was anywhere near as good as a character in the melee area of the tree can get their defenses then casters would be absolutely overpowered because of how safe and easy to scale spells are. They need to be defensively weak and they already are, this is just going to absolutely destroy them.

How do you balance this? MoM is just gone, it was poor compared to proper dex and str defenses before now you just cant have any auras, you wont be able to get enough free mana or mana regen to make it worth anything. If you edit arctic armour to the point where you can actually sustain it now with a much lower mana regen to counter act butchering EB like this then you are gonna put it into a realm where non eb builds can use it a lot easier, and how is that going to be balanced? A lightning coil full evasion ondars guile phase acrobatics endurance charge attacker also now running high level arctic armour?

I dont get it, I just dont get why you would want to take one of the only things thats making life based casters defensively viable and completely trash it.



Is this to try and stop cloak being so pervasive? Is this a zeno "omg nerf cloak omg" thing? Cause I agree its way over used, I totally get why he says that, but surely theres other ways around that which dont involve just obliterating life based spell builds? You could balance that by moving mind over matter into the spellcaster part of the tree somewhere spell casters can actually get it easily and then edit the node itself as the chest is now just giving you the node. Change it to 20% of damage from mana or something. AA was already nerfed to the point where it feels like you are wearing 1k armour against any sized hit that matters even at extreme levels of inner force + lvl25 arctic armour.

Is this just trying to change the caster meta? Cause I mean I can understand a desire to do that but this... man, this is terrifying for life based casters. People think casters are op, theyre not, their damage is more often than not quite meh, defensively theyre a joke, an absolute joke. I have a lvl94 witch with a legacy cloak running a lvl25AA with inner force, vertex, some pretty serious gear, as good as you can really hope for on a cloak of D setup before you start hitting mirror level gears and I can tell you with some certainty shes the most defensively fragile character I have. Im not saying this because I dont want my build nerfed, I have so many builds across all spectrums of characters and for sure, for absolutely sure the idea that cod mom aa builds are some op defense is absolutely nonsense. Im first and foremost a physical attack guy, I have tons of attack builds thats my thing, what Im saying is honestly for the sake of game and casters at large.



Thats my thoughts looking at it, obviously we havent tried it yet, but if you want first impressions, there it is. Casters are already "if you want to have a viable build you need to go to the south side of the tree and take scion life wheel", do this to them and its going to be a case of casters needing to go get iron reflexes or ondars or god knows what else to be able to survive while theyre down there and thats just, imo, nonsense. Esp when you combine it with making them give up life leech or life regen to be able to sustain casting etc... from a distance it just looks like a nightmare tbh.

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