Will hitting level 100 be easier in the expansion?

For some types of players, 100 is and always will be easy unless GGG goes full on nuclear on the latter 90's progression.

The current state makes 100 quite a trek for me (and I love that). All the games I've ever played included the max level as a given -- a milestone that was like a broken record. In this game, it's a choice and by no means a necessity. That may (or may not) be groundbreaking but for me it is new and something I truly like.

If I want it, it's there for the taking....maybe.

As for the argument that buying maps is a must, I've never bought a map and not had any real issues maintaining them. Makes me wonder if I'm lucky or actually doing something right. Probably lucky.

I'm not in favour of making some random level much harder to get because, well, we thought it would take a lot of time. Chris should re-examine his motivation.

There have been no level 100s that have gotten there in two weeks that I've seen/heard of (referencing a comment earlier in thread). In fact the most hardcore/nutso players seem to be levelling out at around 3 weeks at best (Etup etc). YoshiXT managed a level 100 in 214 hours or so? of play, pre flameblast nerf with insane gear. He probably did a map worth every 5 minutes for that whole time (2000+, enough to level an empower to 3 and then some). Yayfun.

I say I'm very against it having played games in which there were goals that took me ten or more years to obtain. But those goals, while having time-based factors tied in, were not purely about time and repetitiveness and they definitely weren't about playing a stock market game.

It's very difficult in a game played by so many to develop quests and goals that can't easily be defeated by the economy and group play, but that *should* be the aim. A multi-year quest that is not about guessing some random combo of items (oh hai, finally got exalt recipe) or finding a secret door no one ever thought to look for, or turning to a stream to get 78 map donations all day, but actually about *hard work and deep thought*.

Forget levels, or remove the cap and put in the harshly diminishing returns I've suggested before. Focus, please, more on designing something that takes a long time to get to because it's hard and requires thought and insight, not because it makes you want to kill yourself from repeating the same action over and over.

"

Charanjaydemyr wrote:

"

jadenharrow wrote:

Since the game was released in full it has never taken anyone "years to hit 100". If this is GGG intention I don't see it mentioned anywhere. I also don't see it implemented in game. It never has been.
I feel that GGG is pretty good about changing what they intend to be in the game. So if this was some illustrious goal of theirs they have horribly failed and from what I can tell have never openly told anyone.

It was expressed several times during the Closed Beta that level 100 was meant to take years to hit. I could dig up some quote but if you don't trust your guild leader/local conduit to the powers that be to tell you the truth about these things, so be it.

And yes, they failed miserably when it came to enforcing that standard. They didn't anticipate people RMTing maps, for a start.

I don't trust anyone on the net just because they say something, and I definitely don't trust people who try adding validity to their opinions by position of authority :P Don't take it personal, I like you as a player and as an AWESOME guild leader (anyone cool should def check us out) however I am a proof type person.
I am not stating you are incorrect, I am stating GGG has not openly published (to my knowledge) anywhere since the game was out of "development" and released. It is also not shown to be their intent.

Which brings me to my next point. Regardless of their intent, taking a year(s) to hit 100 is actually the average it would take for the average active player to do. There is a post at the end of my reply I am going to quote that sums this up nicely. If some extremely dedicated players want to play 15 hours a day every day and do it faster that is an anomaly for players and the rest of us shouldn't be hindered because of that.

To hinder us or prevent those crazy players from hitting 100 and forcing it for even them to take 1 year + would require 3 things. Slope EXP so extreme through all levels that the average players cap at 85 then becomes probably around 30ish. 2nd Scenario keep exp as it until a certain level and from that level on the EXP slope becomes outrageous. The 3rd scenario is to make death penalty so extreme at merci that it causes you to lose insane EXP and or levels etc.

None of these are very appeasing tbh, at least to me personally, and I am going to assume for a LOT of players.
Even after all of this, you are still going to have those players that do it much much faster then almost anyone else.

I would also like to define that I think "time consuming" is a type of difficulty. I am not saying it is hard but for us with jobs etc, spending 10+hours a day in a game can be difficult :P

I wanted to quote this post, because it really outlines how EXTREMELY rare and how long it actually takes for someone to hit 100

"

Asillatem wrote:

lets look up some numbers:

right now there is 274 lvl 100 on the leader boarders (dont know if they are removed if people delete the chars)

the leader boarders contains 60000 chars. (standard,HC,BL and torment)

so around 0,5% for the leader boarders are lvl 100..

if you look at steam spy, there is around 2mill people with POE in their steam library (lets factor out the people who use the launcer) because i dont have the numbers.

so around 0,01% of all the people who ever downloaded the game made it to 100.

now to the time aspect.

lets say you can reach lvl 100 by playing around 3~ hours a day during a 3 month race, thats around 270 hours. Dont know if this is reasonable (never made it that far) so if someone knows, ill edit the numbers.
back to steam spy, the avg played time within the last 14 days is 13~ hours, thats 0,94 hours per day,

So it will take the avg player around 285 days to get to 100...

personal i never made higher than early 80~ bacause it gets to repetitive for ME, so i re-roll..

So back on topic.. is it to EASY ?? maybe, if you are in softcore then its all about time.. so is the time on spot ?? 0,8 year to lvl 100 for the avg person ?..

"

jadenharrow wrote:

"

Charanjaydemyr wrote:

"

jadenharrow wrote:

Since the game was released in full it has never taken anyone "years to hit 100". If this is GGG intention I don't see it mentioned anywhere. I also don't see it implemented in game. It never has been.
I feel that GGG is pretty good about changing what they intend to be in the game. So if this was some illustrious goal of theirs they have horribly failed and from what I can tell have never openly told anyone.

It was expressed several times during the Closed Beta that level 100 was meant to take years to hit. I could dig up some quote but if you don't trust your guild leader/local conduit to the powers that be to tell you the truth about these things, so be it.

And yes, they failed miserably when it came to enforcing that standard. They didn't anticipate people RMTing maps, for a start.

I don't trust anyone on the net just because they say something, and I definitely don't trust people who try adding validity to their opinions by position of authority :P Don't take is personal, I like you as a player and as an AWESOME guild leader (anyone cool should def check us out) however I am a proof type person.
I am not stating you are incorrect, I am stating GGG has not openly published (to my knowledge) anywhere since the game was out of "development" and released. It is also not shown to be their intent.

Which brings me to my next point. Regardless of their intent, taking a year(s) to hit 100 is actually the average it would take for the average active player to do. There is a post at the end of my reply I am going to quote that sums this up nicely. If some extremely dedicated players want to play 15 hours a day every day and do it faster that is an anomaly for players and the rest of us shouldn't be hindered because of that.

To hinder us or prevent those crazy players from hitting 100 and forcing it for even them to take 1 year + would require 3 things. Slope EXP so extreme through all levels that the average players cap at 85 then becomes probably around 30ish. 2nd Scenario keep exp as it until a certain level and from that level on the EXP slope becomes outrageous. The 3rd scenario is to make death penalty so extreme at merci that it causes you to lose insane EXP and or levels etc.

None of these are very appeasing tbh, at least to me personally, and I am going to assume for a LOT of players.
Even after all of this, you are still going to have those players that do it much much faster then almost anyone else.

I would also like to define that I think "time consuming" is a type of difficulty. I am not saying it is hard but for us with jobs etc, spending 10+hours a day in a game can be difficult :P

I wanted to quote this post, because it really outlines how EXTREMELY rare and how long it actually takes for someone to hit 100

"

Asillatem wrote:

lets look up some numbers:

right now there is 274 lvl 100 on the leader boarders (dont know if they are removed if people delete the chars)

the leader boarders contains 60000 chars. (standard,HC,BL and torment)

so around 0,5% for the leader boarders are lvl 100..

if you look at steam spy, there is around 2mill people with POE in their steam library (lets factor out the people who use the launcer) because i dont have the numbers.

so around 0,01% of all the people who ever downloaded the game made it to 100.

now to the time aspect.

lets say you can reach lvl 100 by playing around 3~ hours a day during a 3 month race, thats around 270 hours. Dont know if this is reasonable (never made it that far) so if someone knows, ill edit the numbers.
back to steam spy, the avg played time within the last 14 days is 13~ hours, thats 0,94 hours per day,

So it will take the avg player around 285 days to get to 100...

personal i never made higher than early 80~ bacause it gets to repetitive for ME, so i re-roll..

So back on topic.. is it to EASY ?? maybe, if you are in softcore then its all about time.. so is the time on spot ?? 0,8 year to lvl 100 for the avg person ?..

hey respect the ruler bro

News flash: the handful of people who make it to lvl 100 now will be the same people who make it to lvl 100 tomorrow.

What would be a turn off are the few people who actually lvl to 90-95ish. If that becomes harder, get ready for the pitch and fork crew... and i'll be among them.

I dunno.. I was skimming this thread.

see some good points.
if ggg wants the game to be harder and the difficulty ratcheted
up to reach lvl 100, im all for it.
it's ggg's game and this is a monumental patch, a patch that even has a
closed beta prefacing it going live. So hopefully, the difficulty is just one of
a number of thing's being scrutinized throughout the beta process..
and I'm sure some of the people who are able to hit lvl 100 in temporary leagues
will be invited to the beta for exactly that purpose.
That's not to say the entire experience curve should be balanced around those
players, but it should be taken into consideration when balancing experience at the
95-100 range at least. Most players will not get to lvl 95, and the ones that do will not
mind it being a bit more grindy.

For the record, my main character I play on is lvl 94 in standard..
I typically play solo, and I don't "chain" high lvl maps..
but I do play this game a lot. probably more then I should.
and I am still pretty damn far from reaching lvl 100 on the character
I am attempting to reach lvl 100 with.
So in my opinion, it is not easy right now to reach lvl 100.
Maybe more time consuming / annoying then "difficult." But it's not easy.

How about making leveling to 100 more difficult by forcing 95+ players to risk harder content, rather than simply adding to the time it takes to get there (time does not equal difficulty, although this concept is basically lost on most mmos because making things time consuming is an easy way to gate content or control the speed of progression).

New maps levels 80-90 could be introduced to the game which offer more experience than 78/79 maps for players 95 and below, but similar amounts of experience to 78 maps for 95+ toons. 95+ would get ZERO exp (or infinitesimal amounts) from maps below level 80. And the content in these new maps would be extremely challenging - only the best builds with the best equipment would be able to run them, and the gameplay would require constant attention from the player. That way 80-95 characters who attempt them would gain great exp rewards but would be taking a huge risk, while 95+ characters would be forced to be strong enough to be able to handle them in order to progress at all.

This would achieve the goal of keeping level 100 a trophy only the most dedicated players get their hands on without punishing those who would like to reach a soft cap in the low 90s (this is already pretty time consuming compared to most videogames, so I don't see any problems there). It would also be a further build/gear/playstyle check on high level toons, so that even cookie cutter builds wouldn't necessarily be guaranteed level 100 just by playing 16 hours a day.

I do object to simply increasing the time it takes to get to 100 (and in my own self-interest I object to increasing the time it takes to level 80-90 because that process already takes long enough for me, thanks. I'd like to be able to have multiple characters at those levels because it encourages trying different builds) because I object to lazily replacing difficulty with time consumption and repetitive tasks. It doesn't actually accomplish what those who want level 100 to be tougher to achieve want, which is that only the players most deserving get this reward. Instead, anyone who just puts the time in, even if they don't have the skill, will eventually get there.

I hope levels 1-10 is harder. I'm tired of seeing people get to level 10 so quickly;this was not part of gggs vision for poe.

"

"

MadBro_ wrote:

even tho i do not understand why high end leveling should be harder just because level 100 is supposed to be iconic to some people it will probably be harder...

There are a lot of player types but i am just gonna talk about two. There are people who play the game more than 3 hours a day , reach level ~85-90 and heavily dislike the fact they basically cannot progress any further without crazy luck with maps or a good group just because some people care more for a concept than the actual practice .
Then there are people whose highest character is level 70 or so , "play" PoE a few hours a week and know barely anything about the actual game but they are so attached to the IDEA for reasons they do not fully understand themselves. So for this stupid idea and concept they try to be so uselessly conservative when everybody else has already moved on and wants even more progression (pun intended ) . It just happens to be that the lead developer of this game and some of the hugest wales this game has , if not the hugest are in the second category.

Now i could hope that learning a bit from the majority these people accept a new point of view but frankly it is so much easier to believe they will need a lot of freaking whining and lost potential to do that.

Tldr Saying that level 100 should require 1 year in PoE is extremely archaic and it comes with absolute ignorance of the problems it brings , saddly at least the game developer has the same view (view that brought him the first heavy downvote ever in his history of reddit btw).

popular =/= "good" or "right"

hah ridiculous , yes popular is not always good or right but we are not talking about popular here , we are talking about what is right argumenting it. Meanwhile Chris and Charan are talking about what is right just because it seems a cool and fun idea for them to have no progress in a game just because 100 should be hard to get , they basically screw the whole thing from their lack of experience with the game they helped develop so much .You want to make 100 not achievable ? Great make 100 not achievable , not the 10 or 15 levels before it. Right or wrong are not static permanent concepts , right is what you convince people it is right , Chris does not convince anyone at all.