What is the Ultimate Goal of a Self Found Player?

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Jojas wrote:

I felt like a used car salesman who just tricked a customer into buying an overpriced piece of trash, and celebrates by going to a hooker and do coke.

whats wrong with that exactly tho ?
I dont like car salesmen, but Id estimate something like 75% who have a decent paying job, have to trick customers or co-workers one way or the other. it is what it is. exploitation is world's oldest occupation.

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And I felt really intimidated, and irritated, by seeing how routinely and professionally and de-personalized people do their trading and set up their shops now. In the trading section here in the forum you barely see a thread which isn't 'bumped by procurement' and every one of them has the same 'polite' text: "Welcome to my shop! (Last Updated Sunday, March 29, 2015 3:14 AM), Please message me here or ingame if something catches your eye. My IGN is..." Ugh. So, stuff trading. It's just aweful.

this is also what I don't get. game is about grinding and people want to minimize their time sorting pricing and trading loot, and more time to play the game.

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grepman wrote:

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Jojas wrote:

I felt like a used car salesman who just tricked a customer into buying an overpriced piece of trash, and celebrates by going to a hooker and do coke.

whats wrong with that exactly tho ?
I dont like car salesmen, but Id estimate something like 75% who have a decent paying job, have to trick customers or co-workers one way or the other. it is what it is. exploitation is world's oldest occupation.

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And I felt really intimidated, and irritated, by seeing how routinely and professionally and de-personalized people do their trading and set up their shops now. In the trading section here in the forum you barely see a thread which isn't 'bumped by procurement' and every one of them has the same 'polite' text: "Welcome to my shop! (Last Updated Sunday, March 29, 2015 3:14 AM), Please message me here or ingame if something catches your eye. My IGN is..." Ugh. So, stuff trading. It's just aweful.

this is also what I don't get. game is about grinding and people want to minimize their time sorting pricing and trading loot, and more time to play the game.

The 'used car salesman' is just a figure of speech. I have nothing against them.

Nothing is 'wrong' with procurement. It is just that it's all so businesslike. Most people have no problem with that but for me this has no place in a game like this, even if so much in PoE is all about trading.
But this is almost impossible to explain to someone who sees it otherwise. BMBI above is a good example. He has been here so long, and he must have read hundreds of posts concerning that, and he still doesn't get it and spouts his bullshit.
It's like some people are from Mars and some from Venus. Nobody understands the other side but everyone is happy to judge. Me too. I have a hard time having respect for this approach to gaming.
When I see all these eager traders and their 'bargaining skills', and see their pride in what I basically consider a rather shabby business, and hear all these stories of scams and rip-offs, I cannot help myself but be repulsed.
And I know I'm wrong with that, I know there are lots of great people among them, and that there is nothing at all wrong with trading per se, but I just cannot help myself.

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I just try to get as far as I can without killing the character I've dreamt up. Then I continue if it's still fun.

I base my character ideas solely on what's available via the skill tree, gem combos and things that can be reasonably crafted at the benches. If a unique comes along, I will adjust my build tree or gear to accommodate if it fits or improves upon the plan I've come up with.

and also,

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Charanjaydemyr wrote:

To find myself.

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BearCares wrote:

What is the Ultimate Goal of a Self Found Player?

Having no particular attachment to the self-found philosophy, I'm only mostly self-found.

But for me the goal is simply to play the game, progress and have fun without needing to create and update a shop thread in the forums or spending too much time theorycrafting.
I play the game fairly lackadaisically as well so I don't have a lot of currency for buying any high tier items.

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BearCares wrote:

Before a self found player starts a character I don't see how they can come up with anything other than a leveling gem as their concept. Such as "flame totem" or "cleave". I also don't see how you can plan any timings for gear, and by extension, your passives either because of obvious reasons. Therefore after picking a leveling gem as your character concept (I'm rolling my eyes here), your only task is to experience RNG in lieu of any planning or calculations.

Ouch!
Rolling your eyes? Seriously?

Okay, concepts.
I come up with an idea, and make it work.
These concepts are generally less item dependant than your self-triggering Molten Shell build, but are not based around a single, levelling skill gem.

For example:
2-handed axe melee duelist is the concept behind one character. I believe at the moment they're mostly using cyclone and double strike. (With aura/herald support of course)
Skeleton summoner; that's another concept. At the moment they roll around with tanky zombies and deal their damage with regular skeletons before using echoed Vaal Skeletons and rolling across the map with 'em.
Glacial Cascade with block... Okay, that one's based around a single skill gem, I'll grant you that.
But hell, your example build's based around Molten Shell.

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A self-found player with goals like yours would plan it for their 10th or 15th character. They wouldn't start planning it until they had the bulk of the gear needed in hand.

That isn't really true. You don't really need to get bulk gear or anything like that. With master crafting, you can have a fairly solid build without having to trade.

You can just start with a character and a plan and just go from there. You will have to make sacrifices for equipment, but you also don't have to deal with trading.

I don't believe that self found players are better or worse than those who twink their characters. Each kind of player is just doing what they like best.

I've had a longstanding preference for self found characters (and for naked characters, going back to D2).

Going all the way back to D2, I predictably and quickly lose interest in twinked characters and non-hardcore characters. I enjoy planning out character builds and then overcoming the challenges associated with making the build work in hardcore.

I find that playing games is fun, while trading is not. Also, inventory management is tedious, even with the QOL changes to the stash. So, I tend to follow a simple structure for managing each character's inventory and then either throw out or forget about leftover items.

You'll probably find a few similar themes for a fairly large percentage of players who prefer self found characters.

I'm just making do with what I got because I prefer not to bother trading or partying. It makes all the drops I hoarded on my main character useful, because keeping a ton of decent rares and gems around of all kinds means I can make whatever character I want. Over the past week I've completely remade a bunch of old characters: One into a pierce duration sparker with vaal storm call, self cast IC and conversion trap. One into a facebreaker who can switch gear and gems to completely change its build from a defensive dominating blow to offensive infernal blow depending on the map. Just yesterday another into a dual totem flame trap/searing bond/arc with EE (was hoping to instead use flame totem with coh but it doesn't work with totems ;_;).

All with stuff I had sitting in my stash. But why not trade for it, right? Because that's like trying to play with lego but instead of a big box of random lego blocks you only ever buy specific pieces you need from a store. It's cumbersome and means I view less options, get less creative and resourceful. It'd mean needing to bother selling everything then buying new stuff pretty much constantly. Which I don't wanna do! I'd rather be playing the game.

I just wish there was more of a reason to have all these characters. The facebreaker lets me do no regen and blood magic maps, but otherwise my highest level character can do every map mod. There's no maps that only my totem guy can do, none that only the sparker can do, etc. I'd really like to see more exclusionary map mods, even if they're rare, so that having wildly different characters matters more. Even stuff as simple as -X% less projectile speed as a map mod would be great.

As for me, I just look forward to getting better at racing. Season 11 is over, and I missed out on so much.

My ultimate goal is to earn more than one single point after a race.

What is the ultimate goal of a copy'n'paste cookie cutter player?