anti melee mechanics you need to change imo

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GGG cant do what blizzard did, melee chars get extra damage reduction compared to ranged, because every class can be everything. Maybe they find a way to do this somehow.

Um...yea they can.

Just buff melee weapons. You don't see many bow or trap users picking up axe nodes or armor, do you?

If you're that afraid of spectral throw, nerf it again. It's only been nerfed 3 or 4 times, it won't mind another one...

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TikoXi wrote:

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GGG cant do what blizzard did, melee chars get extra damage reduction compared to ranged, because every class can be everything. Maybe they find a way to do this somehow.

Um...yea they can.

Just buff melee weapons. You don't see many bow or trap users picking up axe nodes or armor, do you?

If you're that afraid of spectral throw, nerf it again. It's only been nerfed 3 or 4 times, it won't mind another one...

Spoiler

In all seriousness, GGG, remove spectral throw entirely. It's a bloody albatross around melee's neck for as long as it's existed.

Yeah, destroy a skill for no reason other than the fact that you dont like it and buff melee overall, sure, easy talk, easy done, right? Sure...

Yea, it is that easy.

Yes, Spectral throw needs to go. It's the most fundementally flawed skill in the game. I shaln't bother explaining it to you, there are thousands of posts on forum threads about spectral throw.

Buffing melee overall is fairly easy. Remove armor's diminishing returns, and rebalance the number values - scatter some defensive treats around the weapon nodes like the duelist got. BOOM, done. Monitor game health for 2 weeks, tweak numbers as needed.

Spectral throw is just the specter in the corner, and if GGG can't find a happy medium for the skill without shafting every red-based attack skill in the process, then fucking get rid of it already. I do repeat, it has recieved 2 major damage nerfs since release, and still continues to dominate top-clearspeed builds - a testement to how broken the skill actually is.

As someone else rightly said

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"So yea, melee weapons have this superior damage, whereas ranged weapons have great safety." "Hey guys, I have an idea. Why don't we make melee weapons RANGED!" "Great idea. Can't see how that can possibly go wrong. Have it coded by tonight, it'll be in next patch."

you guys are arguing over nothing, melee already have way more survivability, this is exactly the sort of nonsense we always get caught up in, youre trying to solve a problem that doesnt exist.

Why don't you just stop bickering and get practical?

Properly buffing melee isn't making their offense stronger.
It is to correctly identify when a character is MELEE'ing and increasing his defense dynamically.

I've already posted a suggestion on that. It's straight-forward and similar to how Charges function.

spec throw doesnt dominate clear speeds at all, its pretty much awful right now unless you are a low life 6L shavs mirrored dagger mirrored legacy jewellery mirrored legacy spell damage shield crown of eyes, at which point you dont clear as fast as a shatter chuck or life based mirrored bow char or a low life wander. Honestly I think a flame dab or an arc char clears maps faster than a low life spec throw for solo clearing and you can do them with a full char that costs less than a 1 mirror, less than 1/3 of a mirror.

Melee defenses are insane, have you guys actually tried playing decent melee builds recently? Its sickeningly easy, it makes me worried when I see them saying theres changes to help melee coming because the game is already a complete joke how easy it is with a decently built melee char. Thats why I didnt mention these things in my original post, they need to just sort out a tiny handful of potential 1 shot mechanics and then, imo, make the base level of the game way harder, force us to play ridiculous maps.

I played a 50% regen, vulnerability, phys reflect, -24 max map with a 600 pdps axe 2h bloodmagic gem char the other night and it was easy, it was a total joke and I cant think of a worse collection of affixes for that char to face. If I came across volatile blood I could have been 1 shotted, if there was sprinklers in the map i could have been 1 shotted, if it was a palace then dom could have 1 shotted me, the fact that none of those 3 things were present meant it was a walkover. Unavoidable 1 shots are not the answer to making the game challenging, theyre just bullshit, but the last thing we need imo is for melee to be way tankier than they already are, or to do more damage, we just need people to stop making bad builds and actually realise that current melee deeps and defense makes 99.9999% of the game completely trivial.


Take out the 1 shots, make the average game harder or force us to roll nightmare maps every single time, leave melee dps and defense alone because its already excessive. Spell casters have terrible defenses now, bow chars are somewhat decent but they cant spec the same defense as melee. they dont need the same defenses, for sure, with elss defense they can still be as survivable or more so, so add more boss fights like Jungle Valley in high level maps, add more horrible monsters that force melee range on you and punish your lack of melee level defenses etc. If they just keep buffing defenses the game is going to become such a walkover there wont be any challenge left, its already too easy.

My suggestions:

V Blood: monster on Low Life should start a visible indicator (a la Exploding Arrow) which causes it to suicide explode at end of duration (2 seconds?) or when monster is killed, whichever comes first. (This means you get no timer if you reduce it from non-LowLife to dead in one hit, it just explodes.) Also 40% more monster Life (so 70%*140%=98% the usual amount of damage needed to trigger the fuse); the extra life makes melee V Bloods more dangerous to ranged since monster has more time to close distance.

Palace Dominus: keep first form exactly as is; all attacks telegraphed and avoidable. Further audit second form for performance issues (most notably FPS drops from blood rain).

Do you get xp for exploding monsters? I always thought not. Seems pretty anti-melee if you have to hope the monster explodes elsewhere for no xp gain.

Let's say you get the XP in this case (not necessarily in the others).is

thats not a bad idea actually, cause it punishes excessive damage and actually Im all about finding ways to punish excessive damage, theres not enough of that in play right now, games getting like a 1 shot roflcopterfest.




We were actually talking about melee in HvRs stream last night, what is it that makes melee "bad"? Their survivability is insane, their damage is insane, so whats the problem here? Why isnt melee optimal? It just comes down to the fact its melee, if you have all the damage in the world and a completely immortal character you still have to walk up to every single mob and attack it, its clear speed, it doesnt matter if you 1 shot every single mob in the game you will never clear as fast as arc because by the time you walk up to 1 mob and kill it arc has cleared the entire screen without having to move, or even aim.


So what about we bring phase run back, and it activates for 7 seconds on melee kill, thats how it works, you turn it on and it does nothing until you kill with a melee attack, then you get the boost for a short period. Its the only thing that came out of the discussion that could realistically help the only real problem melee in general has that doesnt involve making melee not melee, to somehow speed up their movement between packs. Another variant, have a rollable mod on quicksilvers that gives charges on melee kill, that way a melee has perm quicksilvers, maybe even let it roll on all utility flasks? I mean, imo thats a bit op but lets face it, surgeons is a bit ridiculous as it is, and thats open to everyone who crits. I feel like perm flask builds maybe need to go, but i wouldnt be against it going for everyone except melee because melee IS inherently slow most of the time and generally requires a lot more skill and concentration.