Gameplay Help and Discussion - What is the theory behind making skill point refunds so expensive? - Forum

The first players to kill Atziri would make substantial tree changes for each boss fight. This is probably the biggest reason to make it expensive to change your tree. Otherwise, people would just respec for each hard area they come across. And you'd level up using the most efficient skills and passives and then switch to your real build when you got high enough. If they were going to do that, they might as well just start you out at level 60 to save you the hassle. Guild Leader The Amazon Basin <BASIN> Play Nice and Show Some Class www.theamazonbasin.com	Posted by mark1030 on Jan 31, 2015, 11:24:13 AM Quote this Post
" mark1030 wrote: If they were going to do that, they might as well just start you out at level 60 to save you the hassle. Would LOVE that option so much... even just skipping normal once you have one char at lvl 85 ot something like that would be really great... Current Builds: All in one Thread until i make new Guides poeurl.com/c4vT Last edited by ZweihundertMorder on Jan 31, 2015, 5:52:27 PM	Posted by ZweihundertMorder on Jan 31, 2015, 4:05:33 PM Quote this Post
" ZweihundertMorder wrote: Obviously they don´t want you to level up ONE character and then respec when you want to try a new build. They want you to level up a new character for a new build. Why? It ads playtime. You may feel like buying new MTX for your new character. This is it exactly. It's a business rather than game quality choice. The longer you play, the more likely you are to buy something. Dreamfeather Elemental Cleave Ranger: http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/1087616	Posted by Tempada on Jan 31, 2015, 6:36:07 PM Quote this Post
" Tempada wrote: " ZweihundertMorder wrote: Obviously they don´t want you to level up ONE character and then respec when you want to try a new build. They want you to level up a new character for a new build. Why? It ads playtime. You may feel like buying new MTX for your new character. This is it exactly. It's a business rather than game quality choice. The longer you play, the more likely you are to buy something. But that's just not true. The game is balanced around having limited respecs. If you can modify your build according to every challenge that you come across, the game is much less difficult. Similarly, some things are much stronger in the late game and much weaker in the early game. If you can get the upside without the downside, the game is much less difficult. If people want to play an easier version of the game, that's fine, but that's not GGG's target audience. They would prefer that people play the game as intended, and that means making difficult and exclusionary decisions throughout playtime and engaging their brains. Having a Rubik's Cube with all the sides of the same color is not a fun game. You can show it off to people, shine it, polish it, and put it on a pedestal, but that's not "the game". The game is being given a Rubik's Cube with all its sides an array of random colors and working through the process of getting them all to the same color. So, ultimately I guess I do agree with you. It is a business decision that a games company wants to make a game. Last edited by pneuma on Jan 31, 2015, 6:44:20 PM	Posted by pneuma on Jan 31, 2015, 6:43:35 PM Alpha Member Quote this Post
Every time I pay for my ignorance, I become a little less ignorant. That's how I decided to view it. At first I hated it , but now it's just one of those things about the game I accept and try to work around.	Posted by Xtorma on Jan 31, 2015, 9:11:14 PM Quote this Post
" ZweihundertMorder wrote: Would LOVE that option so much... even just skipping normal once you have one char at lvl 85 ot something like that would be really great... Oh my god, seriously, just go play world of warcraft.	Posted by codetaku on Jan 31, 2015, 10:27:45 PM On Probation Quote this Post
Expensive? You get 6-8 respecs I think per difficulty. That' enough to amend any mistake, and even if that's not enough, Orbs of regrets are easy to come by. „I don't give a fuck if it was his tenth anniversary with his goddamn neckbeard...“ „If they think I'm going to let them sweep this pizza guy thing under the rug...“ No mod action. Business as usual.	Posted by Odoakar on Feb 1, 2015, 3:26:13 AM Quote this Post
" Charanjaydemyr wrote: Speaking from extreme experience, you ARE more likely to buy more mtxes when you have 30+ chars to pimp out. But I believe the heart of the matter is that GGG eschew this 'new' idea of builds being more like load-outs or configurations. I've played enough D3 to know that's precisely how it feels -- the closest analogue I can find is to games like Mechwarrior, where you'd shuffle around various bits and pieces between outings for, obviously, no real cost. But it makes sense when you're working with a vehicle -- bits and pieces can be equipped and removed as you want. A character should not be seen the same way. What is learned should not be easily unlearned. I think in making respecs something other than a given, PoE adheres to a very strong (if arguably antiquated, at least in ARPG terms) tradition of character commitment in RPGs that stretches as far back as the early days of D&D. So it's a bit of column A and a bit of row B, I guess. I'm one of those weird people who actually really enjoys leveling up new chars by sticking to a fairly specific regimen each time, just as D2 itself sort of forced us to do. I also think the lack of respec thing is more prominent with PoE because we can TECHNICALLY respec active skills by way of the gem system. I didn't really notice the lack of respecs in D2 because it was all (pretty much) active skills. A fire Sorc from day 1 was going to be a Fire Sorc on day 99. Here, we're handed much more of a blank canvas that is also highly customisable on the fly (skill gems and gear) so perhaps it seems strange that the passive skills are so concrete. That is exactly how skill gems work. You can even swap out gems mid fight. Totally contradicts not being able to respec the passive tree I should add, right now, people stop playing a month or two into every temp league. Why? Aren't they supposed to re-roll another character? I'm guessing having to re-roll to try a new build actually deters many from continuing to play. And changing your passive tree to suit different situations/fights on the fly is no different than switching skill gems to suit different situations/fights on they fly. Why is one not ok, but the other is? ༼ つ ◕_◕ ༽つ Give moar Power Creep Pls Last edited by Druga1757 on Feb 1, 2015, 4:27:25 AM	Posted by Druga1757 on Feb 1, 2015, 4:13:33 AM Quote this Post
Just wait till you get lots of characters to a reasonably high level. Then when you get a full respec from GGG you are totally fucked if you want to try interesting builds and need to respect bandit quest rewards. ROFL, if you need to respect all 3 then that's 60 regrets, just for one character.	Posted by rampagingrabbit on Feb 1, 2015, 4:26:22 AM Quote this Post
Yes, the bandit rewards are very expensive. I don't think GGG has a problem with respecs at all. Each character is given a decent amount from quest rewards. And as has already been pointed out, it's possible to repec on the fly for very specific fights like Atziri. The reason why it's expensive to do so is to tie it to the economy. There are ways to make respecs hard to do that would prevent on-the-fly changes (like before every Atziri fight). Lengthy quest or something. The fact it can be done easily with wealth just shows GGG isnt' opposed to changing/respeccign constantly to suit different situations. It just needs to go through the economy to do so. ༼ つ ◕_◕ ༽つ Give moar Power Creep Pls	Posted by Druga1757 on Feb 1, 2015, 4:57:26 AM Quote this Post