As a former game developer, I am appalled

"

raics wrote:

No, Peterlerock.

There's also a fourth option to ignore the issue but never accept it and stick with the game because there's nothing better out there but whine whenever the opportunity presents itself. It's perfectly viable, actually the most common one if you think about it and I'm not talking just about PoE.

Technically if everyone stops playing it and demands PoE 2 with an modern game engine and rewrite of the entire code to fix this (as well as actually maybe finish a couple of acts) that would do it.

"

tackle70 wrote:

No idea how anyone enjoys playing HC in PoE with desync.

max block with good hp and regen you can afk on uber atziri. or alt f4 macro.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K6RfAztaRXE
you think desync is a problem for him??

big problem as i see it is most ppl play so close to the edge chasing deeps two shots will kill them so you have little margin for errors or desync... budget that into next build and live worry free...im not saying u have to go that extreme liek video. But soemthing bewteen what we play now and that if desync is a problem for you or play hc.

"

RagnarokChu wrote:

Technically if everyone stops playing it and demands PoE 2 with an modern game engine and rewrite of the entire code to fix this (as well as actually maybe finish a couple of acts) that would do it.

Or make GGG go bankrupt before they get past the concept stage. I'm no economy expert, but they say you should start developing your next product when the previous one is at its peak, not when it's well into decline. I won't hold my breath for PoE 2, their next project (if any) will probably be something smaller in scope that will serve to catch some breath. You know, the way Gearbox is taking a break from Bordelands with that new battle arena game.

"

VictorDoom wrote:

Its not that difficult really.. Dont hold AoE attack button on a enemy when you attack them, thats one of the main ways people desync into mobs, if youre attacking something and it doesnt get damaged then type /oos and log out if nothing happens, dont spam movement skills too much, dont rush past packs etc... theres ways of avoiding it with every single character and build, and theres ways to prepare for it in case it happens.

No offense, but this is not addressing the main issues with desync. These are ways to avoid some particularly desync-heavy situations, but it will not help you if your connection lags beyond a certain degree.

Currently, client and server have hardly any control over when they go out of sync. A mob ministuns me and the client doesn't realize it in time. I move half an inch to the right compared to the server, and the game does not correct for it. I run through the next door, but the server thinks I'm running into the wall. Suddenly a small position difference becomes huge.

Even the slightest shift in position can lead to a massive amount of desync over time as server and client will continue to assume they both know what is going on. No matter how you play, if there's a certain amount of lag on your connection this will always happen. The game has almost no desync mitigation - in fact the only thing I can see is an automatic resync after X actions have failed.

"

Peterlerock wrote:

I doubt the numbers of Desynch-Leavers are high enough to make anyone care.

Who can tell, really? I know a number of people not playing due to this issue. My subjective impression is as valid as yours.

"

Peterlerock wrote:

There's only so much you can do in some rare situations, but you can definetly do enough to survive desynch in 99% of situations.

Brutus, Orchard Boss, Dominus, Vaal Smash just to name a few of those 1% situations.

"

Peterlerock wrote:

No, that's not understanding the core of "Love it, leave it or change it".
It's what you can do in any situation of your life, not "what others should do".

If you are interpreting the last part as "let others change it for me", you are both giving up responsibility for yourself and creating a situation that cannot make you happy.

Ehm, no. I'm not giving up responsibility about anything, I am using my small influence as a player to make GGG may more attention to a problem, and in fact do my best to offer possible solutions as well. That is called collaboration, and I am actively trying to improve a situation I am unhappy with.

Your interpretation of this philosophy is not not 'change it', but 'change yourself', and quite frankly that is flawed.

"

Peterlerock wrote:

Yes, creating a "Feedback" thread is some sort of "change it", but GGG has stated endless times that they can't/don't want to adress this issue. So it's a useless way of "change it".

Actually they never have, and you might want to read up on the manifesto on that. GGG is trying to build a game around what is basically donations with their MTX system, and logically try to address what they perceive to be the main issues for the player population.

Desync issue can be solved (or heavily mitigated in multiplayer). However it is impossible to solve it without putting a '2.0' after PoE.

The problem is so intrinsically nested in PoE core-architecture that it requires to 'throw out the baby with the bath water' in order to be solved.

This video show how bad the situation is:
http://vimeo.com/86104923

A game that allows this should be completely rewritten.

I'm very sure that GGG is aware of the problem, and knows how to solve it, since there have been a lot of discussions on the solution. They simply have not the resources to do it in the short time.

"

vezuial wrote:

"

Peterlerock wrote:

There's only so much you can do in some rare situations, but you can definetly do enough to survive desynch in 99% of situations.

Brutus, Orchard Boss, Dominus, Vaal Smash just to name a few of those 1% situations.

Yes, those are "rare situations".
You just named like 0.01% of the game's content. You can name a lot more until you get to 1%.
And even if you get there, obviously the "99%" number I've used above is nothing but a rough estimate, so what would it matter? Would it make my point invalid? No.
And you can actually gear/build for a Brutus Desync not killing you.

"

Actually they never have, and you might want to read up on the manifesto on that. GGG is trying to build a game around what is basically donations with their MTX system, and logically try to address what they perceive to be the main issues for the player population.

http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/889669

Including chapters like:
"Why desync has to exist and why rubber-banding is good"

"

HellGauss wrote:

I'm very sure that GGG is aware of the problem, and knows how to solve it, since there have been a lot of discussions on the solution. They simply have not the resources to do it in the short time.

I don't think they do. Because it's not just the netcode that's incapable of keeping up, it's their rendering engine as well, not to mention the loading times, even during gameplay.

GGG seems primarily a company of designers, brilliant ones at that, and artists, who've also done an amazing job. I don't think they have any programmers employed with in-depth knowledge regarding networking, graphics or memory-management. And with local talent seemingly absent (judging by what we've heard from their search for a graphics programmer) and local laws preventing hiring from abroad easily, I doubt that's going to change any time soon.

I'm certain they know what they have now isn't working, easily possible they've got some vague ideas on how to 'fix' it. But if they had in-depth knowledge on the subject in-house then the problem wouldn't have occurred in the first place.

They have nobody that knows and their circumstances mean they won't be getting anyone that knows.

And regarding PoE 2.0, I sure as hell hope they'll first get someone that does know before proceeding on that front.

"

Peterlerock wrote:

You just named like 0.01% of the game's content. You can name a lot more until you get to 1%.
And even if you get there, obviously the "99%" number I've used above is nothing but a rough estimate, so what would it matter? Would it make my point invalid? No.
And you can actually gear/build for a Brutus Desync not killing you.

So... if I count every boss and miniboss in the game I'll come up with less than 1% 'situations' where desync can ruin the gameplay, but according to your logic 99% are still fine?

"

Peterlerock wrote:

http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/889669

Including chapters like:
"Why desync has to exist and why rubber-banding is good"

Ok, so you're stating that

"

Peterlerock wrote:

GGG has stated endless times that they can't/don't want to adress this issue.

and then you substantiate that claim by linking an article that reads

"

We have many changes coming that will substantially improve the situation

Convincing.

And by the way, the portion you cited simply states that server and client will eventually run out of sync. And that you need mechanics to correct for this. Which is what I am asking for.

"

HellGauss wrote:

This video show how bad the situation is:
http://vimeo.com/86104923

A game that allows this should be completely rewritten.

Thank you for the link. It pretty much showcases the 'XX failed actions within YY seconds' resync trigger that currently seems to be in the game. It also plainly shows that GGG is not using a position control mesh, does not resync at fixed intervals and does not resync after movement skills. This is a prime example of an issue that if fixable, even without rewriting the game engine.